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Eli, Eli, Lama Sabachthani

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Abdicate, Aug 29, 2014.

  1. Matthew 27:46 (KJV)
    And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

    So here we have the translation. It used to be a great distressful verse for me. One I could not reconcile with the fact of Who Jesus is. Why would God cry out like that to God? I've heard ALL the explanations - The Father cannot be in the presence of sin - but then Jesus and the Father wouldn't be One as Jesus said...

    FINALLY! I have the answer and it's so amazing - to me!

    Up until 1551 (NT) and 1571 (OT) the scriptures did not have numbers associated with the verses. In the Jesus' day if they wanted a specific chapter to read, they'd quote the first verse (sentence) since those of the synagogues all knew by heart the OT from cover to cover. So on the cross Jesus yells out Psalms 22!

    Psalms 22:1 (KJV)
    To the chief Musician upon Aijeleth Shahar, A Psalm of David. My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? [why art thou so] far from helping me, [and from] the words of my roaring?

    Jesus was proclaiming while it was happening He was fulfilling Psa 22!

    Here they are:
    Psalms 22:3 (KJV)
    But thou [art] holy, [O thou] that inhabitest the praises of Israel.

    Psalms 22:4-5 (KJV)
    Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them. They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.

    Psalms 22:6 (KJV)
    But I [am] a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.

    This isn't just any worm, but a tolaw (coccus ilics) which lays it's eggs would be deposited under her on a tree where she fixed herself so strongly she'd never leave and die there for her eggs. Upon dying a crimson fluid would stain her and the tree trunk around her. Here Jesus is saying I'm covered with crimson blood dying for you so you can be BORN AGAIN! OH WOW!!!

    Psalms 22:14-16 (KJV)
    I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels. My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death. For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

    Psalms 22:17-18 (KJV)
    I may tell all my bones: they look [and] stare upon me. They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.

    There's more, but I'm sure I lost most already so I'll stop. I hope you enjoyed it.
    Great Fiction, aha, Nanon and 2 others say Amen and like this.
  2. Well done. It never ceases to amaze me how much symbolism Jesus put into almost everything He said.
    Abdicate likes this.
  3. Thanks :) Again, it was given to me, I didn't come up with it :D
  4. Whoa! Good stuff!
  5. Always learning from you brother :)
  6. Thanks all. It's the Lord's doing. He answered my prayer because I didn't like that verse, but couldn't explain it! Thank you Lord!
    Heart_for_Christ likes this.
  7. The tola'at, now that is a new one to me. I recognized throwing dice for garments and other parts, but never the first verse. Thanks Ab.
    Abdicate likes this.
  8. Usually in the Bible, the Hebrew word for a worm is “rimmah”, which means a maggot – but the Hebrew word Jesus used here for worm, is TOLA’ATH, which means “Crimson worm” or “Scarlet worm”. Both scarlet and crimson are the colors of blood – deep red.
    I thought this was fascinating. There are no coincidences when it comes to Jesus.
    Abdicate likes this.
  9. After three days, the dead mother Crimson worm’s body loses its crimson color and turns into a white wax which falls to the ground like snow. So what did Jesus mean by saying “I am a worm”? There are a lot of ideas what Jesus might have meant, but nobody really knows for sure. However, it is very interesting that, just like the Crimson worm, Jesus sacrificed or gave up his life on a tree so that his children might be washed with his crimson blood and their sins cleaned white as snow. He died for us, that we might live through him!
    Heart_for_Christ likes this.
  10. Can you help me out here? Where is it recorded that Jesus used the Hebrew word TOLA'ATH in connection with Matt 27:46? When Jesus quoted the first part of Psa 22, He did so it Aramaic, not Hebrew. Perhaps that is why some misunderstood Him, thinking He was calling on Elijah. Indeed being at Jerusalem, the most common language in use was probably Hebrew with Greek being often used and maybe Latin as well.

    The Psalmist did use H8438 Psa 22:6...yes,though there is no record of Jesus quoting this that I can see; but compare Exo 16:20 Here H8438 is also used (TOLA'ATH), Deut 28:39. ditto Job 4:7.
    So far from being unique TOLA'ATH seems to be a reasonably common Hebrew word for worm/s. (but not exclusively so)

    So what is remarkable to me at least is the fact that of all the utterances of Jesus on the cross, it seems only this reference to the first part of Psa 22:1 alone was uttered in Aramaic instead of Hebrew or Greek or Latin.
    Another interesting use of Aramaic by Jesus was when He healed the Synagogue ruler's daughter. I would have expected that the Synagogue ruler and his wife would of all people been fluent in Hebrew, so why the use of Aramaic?
  11. I'm not really sure what you're asking. If you're asking if he said tola'ath at Calvary, I think the answer is no. If you refer to Ab's op he noted that Jews would recite the first sentence to refer to a scripture.
  12. Sorry if my post was unclear. As for quoting the first sentence to refer to refer to scripture, that is something I would rightly take up with the OP.
  13. Thank you Abdicate, for sharing what you've learned from Psa. 22.

    To see that the Son of God, being strengthened and encouraged by His relationship
    with his Father, suffer total withdrawal of that support in the completion of His
    obedience, strikes holy fear in those who are quickened by His life. Jesus had no idea
    what it was to be separate from God... He was without sin. Yet in becoming sin for us,
    we (who trust Him) will never know this agony.

    Those who are suffering because of their faith will only receive strength and encouragement
    because Jesus was willing to pay the ultimate price in becoming sin for us.
    aha and Abdicate say Amen and like this.

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