Doctrinal Authority

Status
Not open for further replies.
I never quoted mark 4. This is what I quoted and its is about judging.
Do Not Judge

(Matthew 7:1-6; Romans 14:1-12)

37Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: 38Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

39And he spake a parable unto them, Can the blind lead the blind? shall they not both fall into the ditch? 40The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master. 41And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 42Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

We all have the measure of faith and the measure of faith is as small as a mustard seed. And a mustered seed moves the mountian. Faith grows as we step out in faith in daily situations.

Romans 12:1-2 1I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Your mind is renewed daily. but there is nothing that says it does can or should take a long time. You have the mind of Christ now. You are seated in heavenly places now.

I take it your one of those "Faith" folks. The name it and claim it bunch. right?

The faith does have to grow, your right about that, a mustard seed faith won't do much until it is big enough to provide cover for the fowls of the air. Hence why I quoted Mark 4. What measure you give to the Word, it is measured back to you again.

So tell me, How long did it take you to know all there is about faith?
 
Interestingly - "Leaven" is a biblical idiom that's used consistently for the Doctrines of Man (It's also used for sin in general)...

Here's the thing, though... Why is Doctrines of Man idiomatic of Leaven?

You *Think* you are adding "Substance" but you are really adding Corruption. See... Normal "Sin" does not generally carry along the connotation that you are doing something constructive... Most people don't say "You know, this Adultry is going to help my marriage" or "This greed is going to bring me closer to my friends"... But... Adding doctrines DOES do that... We feel like we are doing something constructive when we write a formal statement or confession or creed or whatever...

Then... These Doctrines of Man puff up with Vanity (Emptiness).... They make us feel Superior to others because Those Sinner/Heathens do NOT have the enlightenment that WE share!

BUT... In every single case, the doctrines of man ALSO substitute Vanity for Substance.... How often do you see someone who is "Doctrinally Superior" STOP going back to the Bible as the ONLY single source for their Doctrine and they refer to their doctrinal statements, founding church fathers, important historical figures, Professor such and such, Saint such and such, and the like...

It was a critically important to understand that if we really want to understand - we take God + Nothing! We do not have God + other religion... God + Doctrine statements, etc... We do not make our doctrines with the Bible + church fathers or the Bible + saints or the Bible + reformers... No... The Bible + Nothing!

Thanks

Ya, but what do we do with like the Trinity Creed? It came out of Rome, it protected the deity of Jesus as not being a created being. It was every loosly based on scripture, and set the standard for all statements of faith we see today.
It's also believed by a few. I am talking about the original Creed.

Are these things so bad? The part in the doctrine that you have to embrace the Roman Cathloic Church is bad, but we tend to overlook that part.
Believers even corrupt creeds by taking want they want.

I don't know, seems things are going to get twisted no matter what route you go. I was reading my word the other day and it seem if you have love fo all men, then it tends to fix a lot of things.
 
About five minutes. I like a child Just believe my Father in Heaven.
My bible tells me the mustered seed will move the mountian. SO thats pretty much every thing in front of me.

OK, so if the Word says it, you believe it and that settles it. I got you. Real simple like. I suppose you don't try to spiritualze everything you don't want to believe, Like by his stripes we are healed. Jesus preached to the poor, as in you don't need to be in poverty no more. They type of thing?
 
Yes I believe the word that should really not surprise you. Yes its real simple.

Matt18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
I just believe Him :). You do a lot of supposing and taking it this and that. which is assuming and to assume will make an ass of u and me.

ps And it is regarded as the inerent word of God
 
Yes I believe the word that should really not surprise you. Yes its real simple.

Matt18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
I just believe Him :). You do a lot of supposing and taking it this and that. which is assuming and to assume will make an ass of u and me.

ps And it is regarded as the inerent word of God

I am not trying assume, well not trying to at least. Just trying to pinpoint your belief system as there are many here with lots of belief's. Some here increasing in knowledge but deny the power. Can give you 20 reasons bending up scriptures as to why there are no tongues today, because tongues invovles believing something and the power of God.

Anyway, glad to meet you.
 
Ya, but what do we do with like the Trinity Creed? It came out of Rome, it protected the deity of Jesus as not being a created being. It was every loosly based on scripture, and set the standard for all statements of faith we see today.
It's also believed by a few. I am talking about the original Creed.

I believe the one you are talking about is called "The Old Roman Creed"

You would think that with nearly 2,000 years of Christian church history on top of another 1,400+ years of Jewish history prior to that... and with 41,000+ Christian denominations and countless "Holy Spirit inspired" leaders - we would have arrived a "Perfect doctrine".....

But... We have not. Even the BEST teacher, sage, or preacher ALWAYS has those few things that are out of whack...

It makes you really think - God makes us like that on purpose....

There's a total of ONE man ever who has "Perfect Doctrinal Authority".... and we put Him up on a cross about 1,980 years ago... We don't like being told - "No, you are wrong and I am right - you have to do it my way."

It makes you think... If Jesus Himself walked among us... Would we be willing to LISTEN to Him when He says "No, you are wrong. That's not what it says!" I honestly believe we would respond to Jesus just like the Pharisees did back then....

Thanks
 
I believe the one you are talking about is called "The Old Roman Creed"

You would think that with nearly 2,000 years of Christian church history on top of another 1,400+ years of Jewish history prior to that... and with 41,000+ Christian denominations and countless "Holy Spirit inspired" leaders - we would have arrived a "Perfect doctrine".....

But... We have not. Even the BEST teacher, sage, or preacher ALWAYS has those few things that are out of whack...

It makes you really think - God makes us like that on purpose....

There's a total of ONE man ever who has "Perfect Doctrinal Authority".... and we put Him up on a cross about 1,980 years ago... We don't like being told - "No, you are wrong and I am right - you have to do it my way."

It makes you think... If Jesus Himself walked among us... Would we be willing to LISTEN to Him when He says "No, you are wrong. That's not what it says!" I honestly believe we would respond to Jesus just like the Pharisees did back then....

Thanks

Lots of Wisdom there. I believe Jesus would be labeled a Word of Faith nut, many trying to explain to him with scripture why Healing was only for starting the Church, but not for today.
 
Do Not Judge(; )
37Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: 38Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

What you talking about bud?

You miss quoted the scripture! It DOES NOT say Judge NOT It says, For with the same measure that ye mete( Judge) withal (BY that standard) it shall be measured to you again. That means the standard you judge by YOU will be Judged BY. You can Judge but it needs to be carefully by God's Standard, not man"s.
Not teaching the wrong thing is important because you will answer for what you reach!!
 
What you talking about bud?

You miss quoted the scripture! It DOES NOT say Judge NOT It says, For with the same measure that ye mete( Judge) withal (BY that standard) it shall be measured to you again. That means the standard you judge by YOU will be Judged BY. You can Judge but it needs to be carefully by God's Standard, not man"s.
Not teaching the wrong thing is important because you will answer for what you reach!!

He was responding to my post. I said Mark chapter 4 the law of increase by the Word what measure you mete.

The Word or Nothing told me that Mark 4 is about judgement, which is not in Mark 4.

Matt 7, Jesus said Judge NOT. End story right there because he goes on to explain why we should not judge.

So, Jesus did say Judge not, because with what measure we judge, that same measure is given back to us. In other words, it's best to not judge.
Paul said we are not to judge another mans conscience for what they allow, we all have different revelation and we don't know what Light God has given to someone.

We are also told not to judge another mans servant.

If we have no place to carry out our judgements, then they are unjust and we get judged the same back to us.

It's not about being spot on in Doctrine. That is why I did not make a big deal about The Word or Nothing Going to a completly different scripture than I quoted because He was not trying to mislead. Just Wrong, does not make someone bad.

If I using the Word to twist it and mislead, knowing I am saying wrong, that is a whole other story.

If someone says, Jesus the 2nd person in the Godhead. I in the past would have called them on that. Show me that scripture. I have learned though, it's no big deal.

God answers prayer yes, no or maybe................. Where is that scripturel?

it's the heart and intent that matters.
 
What you talking about bud?

You miss quoted the scripture! It DOES NOT say Judge NOT It says, For with the same measure that ye mete( Judge) withal (BY that standard) it shall be measured to you again. That means the standard you judge by YOU will be Judged BY. You can Judge but it needs to be carefully by God's Standard, not man"s.
Not teaching the wrong thing is important because you will answer for what you reach!!
So were agreed then
 
He was responding to my post. I said Mark chapter 4 the law of increase by the Word what measure you mete.

The Word or Nothing told me that Mark 4 is about judgement, which is not in Mark 4.

Matt 7, Jesus said Judge NOT. End story right there because he goes on to explain why we should not judge.

So, Jesus did say Judge not, because with what measure we judge, that same measure is given back to us. In other words, it's best to not judge.
Paul said we are not to judge another mans conscience for what they allow, we all have different revelation and we don't know what Light God has given to someone.

We are also told not to judge another mans servant.

If we have no place to carry out our judgements, then they are unjust and we get judged the same back to us.

It's not about being spot on in Doctrine. That is why I did not make a big deal about The Word or Nothing Going to a completly different scripture than I quoted because He was not trying to mislead. Just Wrong, does not make someone bad.

If I using the Word to twist it and mislead, knowing I am saying wrong, that is a whole other story.

If someone says, Jesus the 2nd person in the Godhead. I in the past would have called them on that. Show me that scripture. I have learned though, it's no big deal.

God answers prayer yes, no or maybe................. Where is that scripturel?

it's the heart and intent that matters.
You have completly lost me and I believe misread me.
 
So were agreed then

No, Jesus said in Matt 7:1 Judge not.

Steven said that it does not say that but that it says if we judge, the same measure we judge is measured back.

I was speaking of Mark 4 with the same measure you met it will be measured back. You and Steven went to talk about judging which I never mentioned originally or thought about.

Steven said your taking the Word out of context, as it does not say don't judge.

I said that Jesus did say judge not, and explains why we should never judge.

it's hard to communicate even on forums.
 
Ok Thanks for explianing that . my heads buzzing just now got a lot of posts going. It is hard. :)

Yea, Just hate posting a long post, only to find I posted it in the Wrong thread having many tabbed already.

Anyway, I am also Scripture only and Believe in faith in God. If the Word says it, then I just believe it. Glad to meet you brother.
 
Just to ponder

Irenaeus of Lyons (160 A.D.) “Against Heresies” 3.1.1, p. 414.

"We have learned from none others the plan of our salvation, than from those through whom the gospel has come down to us, which they did at one time proclaim in public, and, at a later period, by the will of God, handed down to us in the Scriptures, to be the ground and pillar of our faith."

Clement of Alexandria (CA. 150 – 215), Stromata, Book VII, Chapter 16

“But those who are ready to toil in the most excellent pursuits, will not desist from the search after truth, till they get the demonstration from Scripture themselves.”

Tertullian (CA. 155 – 220)

In refuting a heresy of Docetism (denying doctrine of incarnation), Tertullian writes, “But there is no evidence of this, because Scripture says nothing.” Furthermore, he writes, “If it is nowhere written, then let it fear the woe which impends on all who add or take away from the written word.”

Hippolytus (CA. 170 – 236)

Against the Heresy of One Noetus

“There is, brethren, one God, the knowledge of whom we gain from the Holy Scripture, and from no other source. . . . Whatever things, then, the Holy Scriptures declare, at these let us look; and whatsoever things they teach, these let us learn; and the Father will our belief to be, let us believe . . . Not according to our own will, nor according to our own mind, nor yet as using violently those things which are given by God, but even as He has chosen to teach them by the Holy Scripture, so let us discern them.

Basil the Great (368 A.D.)

The words are to be understood by their plain meaning, not allegorized.

‘I know the laws of allegory, though less by myself than from the works of others. There are those truly, who do not admit the common sense of the Scriptures, for whom water is not water, but some other nature, who see in a plant, in a fish, what their fancy wishes, who change the nature of reptiles and of wild beasts to suit their allegories, like the interpreters of dreams who explain visions in sleep to make them serve their own ends. For me grass is grass; plant, fish, wild beast, domestic animal, I take all in the literal sense. “For I am not ashamed of the Gospel” [Rom. 1:16].’ (Homily IX:1)

To interpret Scripture otherwise is to put ourselves above God, the Holy Spirit, who inspired its writing.

‘It is this which those seem to me not to have understood, who, giving themselves up to the distorted meaning of allegory, have undertaken to give a majesty of their own invention to Scripture. It is to believe themselves wiser than the Holy Spirit, and to bring forth their own ideas under a pretext of exegesis. Let us hear Scripture as it has been written.’ (Homily IX:1)

Gregory of Nyssa (394 A.D)

"The generality of men still fluctuate in their opinions about this, which are as erroneous as they are numerous. As for ourselves, if the Gentile philosophy, which deals methodically with all these points, were really adequate for a demonstration, it would certainly be superfluous to add a discussion on the soul to those speculations. But while the latter proceeded, on the subject of the soul, as far in the direction of supposed consequences as the thinker pleased, we are not entitled to such license, I mean that of affirming what we please; we make the Holy Scriptures the rule and the measure of every tenet; we necessarily fix our eyes upon that, and approve that alone which may be made to harmonize with the intention of those writings."

Augustine (354 – 430)

On the Good of Widowhood

“What more can I teach you, than what we read in the Apostle? For holy Scripture sets rule to our teaching, that we dare not “be wise more than it moves us to be wise.”

In His love

Paul
 
The disciple is not above his master.

I would say...I see a lot of people not willing to admit they are wrong or ignoring scripture, misquoting it, and even twisting it to mean the exact opposite. They just want to debate and it's a pride issue cos they want to be theologically correct according to some ism. Maybe they went to bible college and now have to prove their worth. Cos apparently it costs money to go.

Well Jesus never taught that way. He wasn't into rhetoric or logic, rationalism or airy fairy experiences. He taught right in public, free of charge, and if anyone had a question they could ask Him anything. He had concrete examples of everything.
He also referred back to scripture and said if nobody believed what Moses wrote they would not believe Him.
He did not operate by consensus or church vote saying if we all agree and think so then it's right. If just two or three gather in his name and agree on anything, then whatever we pray for will come to pass. Can you imagine people being at odds with prayer and going...well, I'm not going to say Amen to that!

The promises of God are always yea. So..if there is something you cannot say Amen to, and you just want to disagree for the sake of it even AFTER being shown scripture, then I'm sorry. You need to study to show yourself approved of God. Read the WHOLE Bible. Not just bits and pieces. It's not called HOLY Bible for nothing.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top