Disorder Only Among Humans

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Noblemen, Sep 18, 2016.

  1. God's whole intention from the beginning of time was that He should be the instigator of the rules and regulations by which His creatures would live.
    All nature falls under this subjection to God the creator, for there is nothing in His creation which is ever out of order.
    The only disorder there has ever been in God's creation is among humans beings, who were to fall to this disorientation of God's character so that they might one day find God's true nature. All who are dead in their sins, not yet born again, are disoriented to God's purpose, and only when in our sin we see that we cannot save ourselves do we turn to God for salvation.
    In that turning to God, convicted by the Holy Spirit, He is able then to birth in us His true nature. God's character is in His true nature, and every true believer has that hope within him that the character of God now resident in him will come forth and thus he will adhere to God's true laws.
    Every born again believer who is properly taught the gospel can walk in faith that the life in him is overcoming the issues which are in the mind and is bringing the mind into harmony with that life.
    When a believer wants to give his mind to the Christ within, the Christ within, Who has been made unto that believer wisdom, will cause the believer to know in his mind who and what he is by Christ in him and express it.
    By that expression, this believer will prove to be a perfect lawkeeper by keeping the law of life and love in Christ Jesus, not the letter of the law from the Ten Commandments.
  2. this believer will prove to be a perfect lawkeeper by keeping the law of life and love in Christ Jesus,

    I believe this as well! I try to concentrate specifically on the words of Jesus - they mean the most to me! Thank you for your post.
    Noblemen likes this.

  3. Are you saying that it was in God's character and desire that men fall to this disorientation you speak of? That it was God's original plan somehow, so that men could somehow find God's true nature?

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  4. Excellent question sister. At first reading "Nobleman's" posting, I was quick to say amen and in fact did so. But the more I read it I came to the question you posted.
    Noblemen and Cturtle say Amen and like this.
  5. Sister Cturtle asks a very good question in comment #3. Maybe you could elaborate on your thesis a little.

    And then there is the comment of.............
    "God's character is in His true nature, and every true believer has that hope within him that the character of God now resident in him will come forth and thus he will adhere to God's true laws."

    Are you saying that in all humans there is a spark of divinity?
    Noblemen likes this.
  6. Don't forget about the devil... he too was created and sinned and was not a man.
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  7. My understanding is we were chosen to be "in Christ" before the foundation of the world.
    My understanding is salvation would come by a birthing "Christ in you."
    The true nature of God is found "In Christ."
    The world is a school house to bring humanity to Christ. I see the sin nature being dealt with at the cross, man needs to believe now they need a savior to be born again.
    God had a plan to get us "in Christ" and how He does that Paul calls it a mystery
  8. No
    No they are dead in sin and need to believe they need a Savior. Life is only "in the Son."
    Major likes this.
  9. Im talking about after the creation of the world.
  10. I agree with most of what you are saying. however I would say to you that in my understanding, "sin" was dealt with on the cross but not the sin nature. Our sins were paid for by Christ on the cross for sure, but the "sin nature" was not because the fact is that it is still active in our lives. I agree that it does not control us as Christians and we are not slaves to it, but it none the less is still with us. If it were not so then we would not be committing the sins that we commit.

    IMO, we are “sanctified” or “made holy” because we stand ‘perfect’ in God’s sight because of the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross to pay for our sins. At the very same time we still have a nature that is sinful and that is why other commands are given elsewhere to ‘purify ourselves from everything that contaminates body and spirit, perfecting holiness out of reverence for God which is seen in 2 Corth. 7:1.

    Our position before God is as one ‘sanctified’ or ‘holy’. Our walk often isn’t! But the latter doesn’t change the former! As to when the sinful nature is finally eradicated, that is when we are free from this body. Salvation is in three tenses in the Bible. We were saved (from the penalty of sin), we are being saved (from the power of sin), and we will be saved (from the very presence of sin – when we get our new bodies). It was all accomplished through the cross and resurrection of Jesus but it is all in its own time.

    I enjoy your comments and the doors they open for conversation. Keep up the good work.
    Noblemen likes this.
  11. Our Father has us all where we are in our understanding, to respect each other as believer's is to have an understanding of the Christ that is in us. We as mature believer's should be able to disagree on our search for the meat of the word and the deep things of God. Thank you brother I appreciate your comments.
  12. I agree with you.
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  13. Not sure what you mean here.
    It reads as if it is up to God how much or little we understand. As if He takes us.

    If so that would not be correct for it is up to each individual believer to grow and gain understanding.

    We set the level of growth.
    Noblemen and Cturtle say Amen and like this.
  14. God's plan to get us "in Christ" was through the shed blood of the savior.... could you share the verse your referencing about the mystery?

    In the beginning when God created Adam and Eve, His plan was for them not to fall and give satan the keys to this world, but be obedient to His Word. So that there would have been no need for Jesus to come and die. But knowing what was going to happen He made a plan B :) praise God!

    God did not set us up to fail, or have to find our way to Him. In the beginning He made it very simple...man messed it up, by allowing any questioning of what God had said. Plus if Adam would have used his God given authority to kick that serpent out of the garden and refused to accept the junk he was selling....then we wouldn't have been born with a sin nature, and that would have been the end of it...for the devil would have had no part in this earth.
    Noblemen and Fish Catcher Jim say Amen and like this.
  15. Yes I agree Jim, we give ourselves to the study of Gods word, fellowship with the Lord, we seek Him, doing I believe all we know to do, but none move on in the Lord by themselves, it takes Spirit taught knowledge (revelation) to move on in the Lord, Gal. 4:1-2, Eph. 1:17-18.
    Look at Gal. 1:2 close it says at " the appointed time of the Father."
  16. I believe it is Gal. 1:4 brother. The KJV says............:"according to the will of God and our Father".

    It is the context of that passage of "deliverance". Our deliverance then is according to the will of God and not the law of God. The will of God is that all men be saved and then we are not to live in sin. That is real deliverance.
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  17. Yes Paul never use's the words born again, he always refers to the birthing or Christ in us (us in Christ) as a mystery, Romans 16:25, Colossians 1:26-27. As well as many other scriptures that refer to our "in Christ" position.

    As the "lamb slain before the foundation of the world" I personally cannot see God having a plan B.
    The world today or ever, has spun out of Gods control.
  18. God love ya brother. I do as well but I can not agree that the world has spun out of God's control.

    Wouldn't that diminish the soventry of God????
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  19. Correct, my wording is lacking some but my meaning is as you say the world has never been out of his control, from creation until now. The plan of God is always in action.
  20. Yes God's plan will get done.
    The world or world's system is under the influence of the god of this world or world system.
    Cturtle, Noblemen and Major says Amen and like this.

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