Beware Erroneous Gospel

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Noblemen, Jul 22, 2016.

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  1. Peter cant preach what he does not know.
    So, if you want to talk about water in Acts 2, then be sure to realize that Paul was not an Apostle yet, and Jesus had not revealed "justification by faith" yet.
    So, Peter was preaching John's baptism or Mark 16:16 for the remission of sins, while also telling them to trust in Jesus.
    Later, as he understood "The Grace of God" as revealed to Paul, his "gospel" changes.
    So, if you believe that Peter, in Acts 2.... is preaching "Justification by Faith", as ONLY revealed to Paul many years later, then i'll let you continue in your "situation", while i continue in mine.
  2. My friend
    Let's stay on course here.
    Nothing was said about seeking forgiveness over and over for past sins.

    Yes there is sowing and reaping and every one on this planet is subject unto it.

    Now this has nothing to do with if a believer sins after being born again other then what it means to every one at all times.

    If a born again believer did not need to repent and seek forgiveness of their sin after becoming born again then the Lord would not ever need to chastise or rebuke one of His own and if the believer has a correctable heart then they will quickly repent and seek forgiveness.

    To claim once forgiven all is already forgiven and we need do nothing more is as a devilish religious doctrine.

    So please see nothing is being said about staying saved. Unforgiven sins won't make you lost after being born again But it will hinder your walk in Christ.
    chili, Major, crownoflife and 1 other person say Amen and like this.
  3. We, the believers, do not "seek forgiveness of sin", if the blood of Jesus has redeemed us.
    Bottom line.
    If it hasn't redeemed you, ...if God has not given you the "gift of Righteousness", then go ahead and confess and receive Christ as savior so that your "sin" can be dealt with... (Salvation).

    Romans 4:4
    Hebrews 8:12
  4. Why do you feel Paul had the only I s
    OK let's try this one more time.
    If a born again believer (one who has been washed and forgiven) sins.

    Sin is anything we know is wrong but still do.

    Now this sin won't send you to hell and it won't take away your salvation but it will work against you in this life.

    1. It gives our enemy the devil Right to come in and begin to steal,kill and destroy.
    2. These sins left alone or ignored by the believer Does Hinder any results you are looking for through faith.

    3. Just as walking in unforgiveness toward Any one or Any thing hinders your Faith and Prayers and so forth,
    Un dealt with sin in your life will do the same thing.

    We as believers are required to deal with any sin in our life.

    Once a person is born again we must seek growth in Christ. We have commands to live by and we don't have the right to pick and choose what we obey.

    To say Jesus already forgave all my sins, past, present and future so anything I do now is automatically forgiven and I don't need to do anything or Deal with these sins is saying the blood is a license or free pass to sin.

    crownoflife likes this.
  5. You switched your theology.
    First you said we had to confess, as it was necessary.
    Now you are trying to change from this topic, to another one, which is, "license to sin".
    So, its best that you stay on Topic, so that we can have the same discussion.
    Is this ok with you?

    So, to begin with, you are no longer under the law., but are "under grace".
    Are you aware of this?
    And once the law was removed from you then the Law has no more power to describe your "works of the flesh" as sin.
    Sin is only known as Sin, when there is LAW that judges you as a sinner.
    But now you are not judged any longer as a sinner, as we are "redeemed from the curse of the Law".
    We are now "under Grace", and our sin has been forgotten and forgiven.
    This is why you dont "confess" sin.
    Romans 4:8
    Hebrews 8:12
    And as i already told you.......if you commit to a lifestyle that is immoral, then you will pay the consequences for this behavior on earth, as there is a spiritual law in this EARTH that the Cross did not remit......= "Sowing and Reaping".
    Therefore, if you "sow to the flesh, you will reap corruption".
    if you live like a sinner, you will suffer like a sinner on the EARTH, but never after you die, as Jesus has been judged for your sins, so that in Eternity, you wont be judged.
    If you live a life on Earth that is the same as a lost sinner, then you will reap the consequences of your sin, while you are still on this earth.
    That is your "license to sin", answer.
    See it?
  6. I will reply later for my break is about over. I did not change or switch any theology for I have no use for it. I simply answered what you once again brought into the topic.
  7. Did i bring in "license to sin", or did you?
    You did., and that is not our original topic.
    So, i dont mind talking with you as long as we stay on topic, and the topic is why you say you need to confess your sins to "grow", and i say you dont confess sins, if you are saved by the Blood.
    Let stay there.

    So, now that i understand your theology, you are going to post, 1 John 1:9 at some point.
    But before you do, read 1st John 2:1, and note, that John has begun to talk to the believers.
    This is shown by the fact that he addressed them as "children", which is his typical greeting for the brethern.
    You dont find this in 1st John 1:1-9.....and there is a reason for that omission.
  8. Greetings @Abodah.....this statement that fcj made is in response to your belief that once we are forgiven we no longer need to ask for forgiveness. It's not him changing theology, but saying what happens if we stick to what you are saying. So in my opinion he was staying on the topic you both were discussing.
    If you disagree with that comment, then say you disagree , rather than twist things around saying that he is changing his theology.

    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  9. #69 Abodah, Aug 10, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2016
    Yes, once we are forgiven, we no longer ask for forgiveness.
    Thats correct, .... as if you are forgiven, you dont ask for what you already have....
    The only reason we would ask for forgiveness, is if we needed to be forgiven again.
    Thats not possible if the Blood of Christ has been accepted on our behalf by God.
    If as you are suggesting, we need to be forgiven again, then this means we are lost again.
    That doesn't work, as salvation is not a situation where we are lost today, saved later again if we confess.
    So, you have to let go of this word "forgiveness" as this implies "not saved", and in need of being forgiven again.
    If as you are trying to teach it...we need to be forgiven over and over, then this means we need to be born again, over and over....and that my friend is theology that isn't biblical.
    So, lets just stay with Saved, with a "d" on that word, as in "finished".
  10. Brother @Abodah Greetings
    I have not changed anything I have been saying nor have I strayed off topic. Why do accuse me of these things over and over? :)

    Being under grace and not under the law have nothing to do with this.

    Yes we have grace to run to but what do you do when you get there? Why, one repents and seeks forgiveness is what they do.

    The life style you paint in this reply is as wreckless as a car with a stuck gas pedal and no brakes.

    Let's look at the word sin for a believer. This would be anything opposed to the written word of God.

    Example a born again believer attacks other members in a forum. This would be sin for it is opposed to walking in love.

    Now according to what you write....we do nothing about it because Jesus already forgave us. That is wreckless
    and most dangerous way to live.

    No friend we must submit to God and walk in His ways. Now not repenting and seeking forgiveness does in so give the devil an open door.

    Notice scripture says Seeking some one to devour For he needs a believer to give him a way in.

    Living life as a believer without further repentance of sins is why the body of Christ has Adult full grown babies. Not because they are new born but because they refused to change and take responsibility for their actions and did not ever come out of their spiritual pampers. Sad!

    Be blessed my friend
    Cturtle likes this.

  11. As i said previously, i didnt bring up "license to sin".
    So, anyway...
    We dont confess sins to grow as Christians, and we dont confess our sins to "stay saved".
    The way we grow in grace is to be active in the will of God, which includes doing the works of a disciple of Christ.

    Your sins are gone.
    Jesus has died for them.
    So, dont waste your time "confessing" what God does not remember, or what God has judged Christ for, on your behalf.

    Now, when we behave in a way that is not pleasing to God then we are to talk to God about this, but we dont confess "sins" with the idea
    of needing to be forgiven over and over, as when a person is doing this, they have not understood the Cross or the Blood atonement.


  12. Mark 16:16 is saying clearly that the person who is saved will want to be baptized and not that it is needed in order to be saved.

    Paul was not sent to baptize at all whether he was an apostle at that time or not.

    1 Cor. 1:17........
    " For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, and not with words of eloquent wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power."

    I will honor your request and leave you in your understanding and I will continue in my, ..."situation".
  13. #73 Major, Aug 10, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2016
    1 John 1:9
    "If we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness".

    My dear brother. I understand your thinking and I have over many years discussed this question with Christians. It is not a new situation at all and if I may, I will try to answer your question if you will receive the help.

    The question or situation you have brought up being:........
    Why are you supposed to seek God's forgiveness if He has already justified you?

    If justification takes care of sin past, present, and future, so there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ ( according to Rom. 8:1, why pray for forgiveness? Aren't you praying for something that is already yours?

    The answer is that divine forgiveness has two aspects. One is the judicial forgiveness God grants as Judge. It's the forgiveness God purchased for you by Christ's atonement for your sin. That kind of forgiveness frees you from any threat of eternal condemnation. It is the forgiveness of justification. Such pardon is immediately complete — you'll never need to seek it again.

    The other is a parental forgiveness God grants as your Father. He is grieved when His children sin. The forgiveness of justification takes care of judicial guilt, but it does not nullify His fatherly displeasure over your sin. He chastens those whom He loves, for their good which is what we see in Heb. 12:5-11.

    You see, Judicial forgiveness deals with sin's penalty parental forgiveness deals with sin's consequences.

    Judicial forgiveness frees us from the condemnation of the righteous, omniscient Judge whom we have wronged — parental forgiveness sets things right with a grieving and displeased but loving Father.

    Judicial forgiveness provides an unshakeable standing before the throne of divine judgment — parental forgiveness deals with the state of our sanctification at any given moment and is dispensed from a throne of divine grace.

    So the forgiveness Christians are supposed to seek in their daily walk is not pardon from an angry Judge, but mercy from a grieved Father.

    I hope you will receive this and allow it to help you in your life and faith and walk with Christ. Again, I have no desire to argue with you and if you so desire I will leave you as you are in your situation.
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  14. The issue with 1Jn 1:9, is that John is not talking to believers.
    This is shown by Chap 2 where he begins to talk to them (my children).

    Also, transgressions are sins, and there are no levels of transgressions.....there are not "parental transgression" and "eternal transgressions".
    There are no venial sins or mortal sins.
    The bottom line is, sin has been dealt with, on the cross.

    Now, a better way to explain what you are trying to prove is this..

    You have a wife.
    Marriage is the relationship.
    If you make her very angry by doing something foolish, then your marriage is not in trouble, but your peace with her, your fellowship with her, is in trouble.
    In other words, the peace and harmony between you and your wife is based on not grieving each other by doing something inconsiderate, hateful, or mean.
    And if you do, then this does not break the marriage, but it does create chaos within the relationship regarding the peach and harmony between you two being lost.
    So, to restore the PEACE that has been damaged by behavior, you have to say, "im sorry".
    So, in this regard, if a person is found doing things, behaviorally, that are a contradiction to their Christianity, then they will lose their peace with God, until such time as they say, "im sorry".
    That is what you are actually trying to explain, and what CJim, keeps confusing with "confessing sins".
    So, saying you are "sorry", is not the same as confessing sin for forgiveness., as CJim keeping being confused about...... and that is the distinction im making that some of you who are posting to me, are not understanding.
    We dont confess sins to God as we have none of those as Jesus "became sin" for us and died....., but we do tell God we are sorry for our behavior if we are not behaving as we should, as this has caused our peace and harmony with Him to be be interrupted, exactly as it would be if we did something in any Relationship that created bad feelings.
    So, we are to say we are sorry, but were dont confess sins to be forgiven, when in fact we have already been forgiven for them.


  15. I am sorry brother but I can not agree with you in that 1 John is written to "Unbelievers".
    I am also sorry to see that you have rejected the accepted teaching of "Judicial and Parental" forgiveness.

    The context of any passage is always the key to understanding and in 1st John the context
    would indicate it refers to believers exclusively. The apostle John calls his readers “my little children” in 1 John 2:1, which is still connected to John’s thought in 1 John 1:5-10 because like 1 John 1:5-10, 1 John 2:1 is discussing sin. There is no chapter break in the original. 1 John 2:2 is also still connected to John's thought in 1 John 1:5-2:1.

    John says “and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.” In this passage, John is
    distinguishing he and his readers from the rest of the world, and the world in this passage is an obvious reference to unbelievers. So because he is discussing sin in relation to fellowship throughout 1 John 1:5-2:2, “my little children” in 1 John 2:1 and John’s statement in 1 John 2:2 would indicate the “we” in 1 John 1:7-10 is a reference to believers.

    The issues John discusses throughout 1 John also make clear that entire epistle is written to believers and not unbelievers. In this epistle, he was attempting to protect the church in Ephesus from false teachers teaching false doctrines.
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  16. Agreed! The logical conclusion of never having to confess sin is that we as believers are then able to do as we please. That then becomes the false teaching of "Sinless Perfection".

    If we look at the people in the Bible, when they came really close to God, they didn’t claim to be sinless. Instead, they became increasingly aware of their sin. Consider Isaiah in 6:5; and Daniel in 9:4-19 and then Paul in Ephesians 3:8. Paul, of course, cried out: “O wretched man that I am.”

    According to R. C. Sproul, the doctrine of sinless perfection is, in fact, perfect erroroneuse false doctrine.
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  17. Exactly brother .
    That whole thinking turns Grace and The Blood into a license to sin. I mean hey already forgiven so oops my bad and you wanna do it again.
    Sad thinking in this thread.
    Blessing Major and Thank You for your input.
    Cturtle likes this.
  18. Thanks for your words and may God continue to bless you my brother.
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  19. I just wanted to thank you for this explanation. It truly did bless me. I kept trying to figure out and was praying how to explain the difference and God sent you to explain it beautifully.

    I also wanted to say how blessed I am with the way you are writing lately. Seems like the time away did you good as well :)

    God bless you abundantly
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  20. When you mention another members name in a post there are two things to remember
    1. Be polite and Respectful by getting the name correct

    2. Always use the @ before the user name. That tags them and allows them to know some one mentioned there name.

    Example @Abodah

    Thank You
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