Be overcoming

Discussion in 'Holy Spirit Baptism and Living' started by JohnC, Jan 22, 2015.

  1. Be Overcoming... Present tense, active, continuing...
    Overcoming - not Overcame (Past tense, completed) which implies that you are finished.... Not "Victor" - also past tense, completed, but it implies that you beat all the others who ALSO overcame....

    There's a reason it's present tense, active, continuing - We never stop Overcoming.....

    Overcoming is one of the hardest things we do as Christians, but it's also has some of the greatest blessings we can receive....

    There is a process for overcoming. It's not a once and done thing...

    I want to start to present this process as well as encourage you to give it a shot.
  2. #2 JohnC, Jan 22, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2015
    How many times have you heard a church sermon where they talk about "Repentance" as if it was just a switch you could turn on and off? If you would ONLY do better this time - God would bless you! But no - you won't repent...... Sinner!

    But, what's the real message in those sermons? That choosing to reject self-willed narcissism and hedonism and instead, choosing self willed morality or compassion is "Repentance" and the opposite is "Backsliding..."

    THAT'S NEITHER REPENTANCE, NOR OVERCOMING! Huh? That's not what they said in the sermon.... Nope - and it's why what he said in the sermon didn't ever produce any actual results.... It's easy to preach - but produces no fruit! All it does is to make you feel bad because you are useless and worthless because you don't have the fortitude to BE VICTORIOUS!

    At the very most basic root of Sin is self-will. Moving from Self-will to Self-will is a ZERO-SUM game - no matter how good or bad the adjective attached to it sounds (moral, narcissistic, hedonistic, compassionate, etc.) Changing from Narcissistic self-will to Compassionate self-will IS NOT repentance! Changing from Moral self-will to Hedonistic self-will is NOT backsliding..... Both are simply moving from self to self and back to self again - there's no God in it.....

    What then is REAL repentance? This statement hidden in the middle of 2nd Timothy 2:25 is the KEY.
    ".... If perhaps God may give to them repentance....":

    If perhaps God may give to them Repentance!

    God gives the power of HIS will in place of our own self-will - and this is the beginning of actual, lasting, fruitful Repentance and Overcoming....

    This is what is missing! Repentance DOES NOT come from within yourself - it comes from God!
    It's a gift from God that we do not deserve... and we must treat it this way......
  3. To repent is to change one's mind. Gaining information and a willingness to accept the truth allows the Spirit to open our eyes. So, change your mind. :D
    Fish Catcher Jim and Cturtle say Amen and like this.
  4. I did change my mind when I finally realized I had no power within myself to "Repent" from anything....
  5. So... Sounds like something you want?

    The first step is to believe on Jesus as Your Personal God who gave His life for you on the Cross and rose again the 3rd day.
    With all your Mind/Intellect.
    With all your Emotion.
    With all your Volition.

    This is where a lot of people have trouble - they don't actively BELIEVE with all 3.... They believe in their emotion - but can't get their head wrapped around "A guy in Jerusalem".... They believe in their Intellect - but can't get past injury and hurt and disappointment... They think they believe but can't act...

    This has to get worked out first before you can make any real progress.
  6. The next thing....
    Cry out to God.

    You are going to approach God in your secret place - confessing your reliance upon your own Self-will before God... and it's especially important that you have wrapped your mind around the complete inability to succeed without Him and His Repentance. Confess the truth - that you have tried over and over and over and failed because your own will is useless to repent and overcome. You know you don't deserve this out of Him - but you understand that the ONLY way you will do anything but fail is through His strength and His will alone.

    Jesus - grant me your repentance because my own will is useless and I will just keep failing.

    He is faithful though we are not. He will in no way lose that which has been entrusted to Him.
  7. Next comes the Ongoing, present tense, continuing FIGHT.. Overcoming every single day.... Neither Satan, nor your own flesh are particularly happy to give up that easily - and they won't..... Just because God grants you to BEGIN overcoming through reliance upon HIS will and His strength - this doesn't mean that your willful nature or Satan will happily go along with it..... Your sinful nature and Satan are going to FIGHT - and they are going to fight HARD.

    You are going to have to use every single resource available to you.

    #1 - DO NOT RELY ON YOUR SELF WILL... It wasn't helpful before - why would it be now? You NEED to call in the Heavy Artillery! Continue to Call out to God and ask for His strength, His Will, and relief Earnestly and Early. "God, I am weak. I will fail without Your hand on me now. ......"

    #2 - 1st Corinthians 10:13 Look earnestly for the way of escape. Find the way of escape. USE the way of escape.... Do not be embarrassed about doing this..... Thank God for providing the way of Escape!

    #3 - The full armor of God - Ephesians 6. You will need THE WHOLE THING.

    #4 - Do not "Covenant" with sin. Do not say "Well, this much is OK.... but I won't go further." This is a sure recipe for disaster because you have now put your reliance back upon the Self-will that got you here in the first place. Sin will say "Yes, I will covenant with you" - but she never stops... An inch becomes a mile and soon - you are 7 times WORSE than where you started.... Instead - go back to #1 - fall back upon God's strength, God's power, God's will instead of your own self-will and strength.

    and last - Encourage others. Serve others. Help others to do the same!
  8. One plants, one water, it's God that gives the increase.
    Jesus the author and finisher of our faith.

    Repentance just means to changes ones mind.

    First.............. in Timothy's case, folks had listened to the devil so long they opposed themselves. (Their fault)

    2Ti 2:25-26 kjva 25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; 26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

    This is a Satanic bondage here, not just a normal situation.

    Also, pray over scriptures. The Holy Spirit will prompt us to check things out before we go and teach it. I have learned the hard way to get excited about something and just run off with it.
    We teachers need maturity in this area.

    You said God will give the power of HIS WILL over our Self-will........
    Zero scripture says that, and that is not going to ever happen. Ask Jonah who God transported via fish kicking and screaming just to save a city. Ask Zackerias (spelling) who said something stupid and could not longer speak to foul up the plan of God.

    Jesus is not granting repentance, the Engrafted Word is able to save our souls (Thinking) being transformed by the renewing of our mind gets us in line with God's Will V.S our will.

    Jesus said what measure we mete to the Word, more of the Word shall be given (Mark 4) No measure, no more revelation. Some only produce 30, 60 ......... Some with full measure to the Word 100.

    No seeking, no finding........... No asking, you have not, because you did not ask.

    Be careful about translations!!!

    One reason we pray over something and seek the Holy Spirit and not just assume we got it. Translators try to help us out by adding words that are not in the Greek or any text. The Holy Spirit can give you a check to looking into something, it's our safe guard.

    One time out of zeal and wanting to get a great "NOOB" message across I wrote they broke Jesus bones, and made him bleed for us because he loves us."

    I did not know many scriptures, but I got a check about that. So I took the time to look into it before I sent the letter. Sure enough, Jesus did not get his bones broken. I thought the message was right on scripturally, but it was off in other places also.

    What the Greek really says..............

    In Meekness and instructing, (To those that SET THEMSELVES Oppostie) God WILL................. GOD WILL............ GOD WILL... ( if and preadventure is added by the translators)
    God will give them a reversal, opposite of what they believed A percise knowing of the truth.

    So, if we give the Word, and someone is in bondage and captured by the enemy, God will give light and revelation to that person every single time performing the Word in our life with signs following.

    The Person still has a choice, to accept the truth or not accpet the truth. Lots of scripture of those that obey not the truth, and they do it by choice.

    We plant, God expands and reveals the Word to those we plant the seed of the Word of God.

    You had some other good stuff up there though. Be careful adding and getting ahead of the Holy Spirit. Watch translations, all translations are done with someone's doctrine in mind, even the definitions in Strongs and Thayer.
  9. How many sermons have I heard on this subject -- "Change your mind" - so get to it.. By your resistance on this - it's apparent that you have never had to LEAN REALLY HARD continually on God for ongoing repentance. I am glad you are strong and have great fortitude.

    I don't. I know what it means to be weak in the flesh.. To constantly fail. I know that my own will and fortitude and strength is useless.... If I don't make a conscious effort to "Put on The Lord Jesus Christ" (Romans 13:14) - I fail.... In real life.

    This is the situation when we are trapped - covenanting with Sin... Look at the Book of Judges 1-3. That's what happens... We covenant with Sin... We draw a line in the sand with our toe and say "This far but no further" - and then what does God do... He says "Ok, Fine... You won't fight - I won't drive them out for you anymore! You will have to learn how to fight!"

    telling somebody that all they need to do is to "Change their Mind" is worthless because all you are telling them to do is to put on more self-will.... and self-will is how we got here in the first place.


    Try again brother. The Entire Bible - from cover to cover is about this subject. Relying upon our own will and strength is not the solution, it's the Problem - and it's been the problem from Adam eating the Fruit all the way till Man faces the Final Judgement.

    Then why is that the only way it works in real life? That you have to make a conscious decision to "Put on the Lord Jesus Christ".... To seek out "The way of Escape"... To go straight back to God confessing "I am weak and I cannot do this without your strength"....

    No, it's not added. They put added words in italics in most translations.. It's in every single translation because it's there in the greek. The conjunction used "mepote" means "if perhaps" - it carries the connotation of uncertainty....

  10. The Words are "ADDED" Do not rely on them putting the Words in italics. They have their own doctrine helping interpet the Greek.

    Many passages stray from making absolutes, because the lack of understanding of faith and power in the Word.

    "Try not to be fearful" Instead of "Fear not"

    2Ti 2:25 ABP εν in πραότητι gentleness παιδεύοντα correcting τους the ones αντιδιατιθεμένους being in opposition; μηποτέ lest at any time δω [ 2 should give αυτοίς 3 to them ο θεός 1 God] μετάνοιαν a change of heart εις to επίγνωσιν full knowledge αληθείας of truth;

    This is the same Greek the KJV uses............. If we give instruction, teach, shead truth to them, God will change the heart to see the full knowledge of the truth.
    God will put the heart in a condition to see truth.

    We teach, God reveals. We plant and water, God gives increase.

    The Greek Word confusing the translators is mēpot
    translated Least, Haply, weather, Or not.

    If means if this don't happen, then that happens. If that happens, then that happens.

    If we preach the truth to help someone trapped by Satan, then God will give them a heart of understanding the knowledge of the truth.

    Recover themselves: Their Job, not God's

    2Ti 2:26 kjv+ And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

    If God just replaced His will in them, then they would be fine and it would not be under their own power.

    That is not what the scripture says, it says THEY have to take that light and truth they now know, and use it to recover themselves.

    You missed that verse above.

    Be careful of not quoting above and below............ THEY still have to do the recoving with the new light they have.

    God does not force his will on anyone, and People will die in bondage to Satan if they don't respond to the truth and light given.

    Rom 10:14 kjva How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? [and how shall they hear without a preacher?

    Without us coming with the Word and correction, God has nothing to increase in them. If we give the Word to someone who Satan has captured, then God will take that Word and cause their heart to change to see the truth. Once they have light, they can take that and Recover themselves out of the snare of the enemy.

    You said a bunch of other stuff about God's will, and My super walk with God, which I want to address because most of what you said, I never mentioned or said. This is long enough though.

    So, there is no Uncertainty in the Word given. We have to preach, LEST they have no light. God always performs his Word, Always causes the increase. Always gives light.

    Even after God gives them Light, they still have to Recover themselves. It's not a done deal, they also have a part.

    There is also Word's in season, and out of season. That is another topic.

    I can adress the rest later. MEPOTE means haply, Lest. We preach the word, LEST God gives them light.

    If we don't preach, no light. LEST is a condition of cause and effect, it has two sides.

    Lest by her continually comming, she bother me.......................
    Did she keep coming back? Nope, some translations say she did.

    If we give the Word, God preforms his Word.
  11. Luke 15:4-7 So the question is, who was lost? The sheep. Who looked and looked and looked until found? The Shepherd. Who found the sheep? The Shepherd. Who picked it up? The Shepherd. Who rejoiced? The Shepherd. Who called his friends to rejoice? The Shepherd. Who rejoiced? The Shepherd and heaven. Who repented? The sheep. Wait. HOW!? It consented to be found - meaning it didn't run away. It rested on the Shepherd. It was ALL 100% the Shepherd. :D
    Arrie03 likes this.

  12. What do you think about
    'True compassion is to do the will of God.'
    St. John 5 Jesus walked by the pool of Bethesda and healed only one man.

  13. What do you think about
    'True compassion is to do the will of God.'
    St. John 5 Jesus walked by the pool of Bethesda and healed only one man.
  14. What other ones were there to heal?
  15. I just want to clarify this.. I know that you are not proposing or advocating the blasphemy that God is some sort of dog who performs at our beckon call. There are some who teach a doctrine that boils down to: You whistle and God shows up with treasure and health...

    I know that you are fully aware that way it works is that God invites and allows us to participate in His program - not the other way around. In every case - the word declaring God's program is the word that God put into the man's mouth.... Never was man given the authority to dictate the program to God. Let's make sure we communicate this clearly....

    That said.... The argument I am making on 2nd Timothy 2:24 I posted does not rest upon the "If Perhaps" - the greek word "μήποτε" that you seem to be focusing on - but rather "God will grant"...

    My argument is that it is GOD who must grant true Repentance - the ABILITY to start overcoming... We can not achieve true Repentance and Overcoming until we rely 100% upon God's power and God's will for the repentance and overcoming.... That's not easy to do - because we are strong willed people... We can't bring ourselves to rely upon the strength and power of God until we completely loose the grasp on the end of our rope and land hard in the rocks below.... It's generally not until that point do we grasp "God, I am weak and I can't achieve this unless You give me the strength" ... or as Romans 13:14 puts it - "put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ,...." It's only through "Putting on Jesus" that we can make any progress at "For the flesh, make no forethought -- for desires."

    As an aside - the interesting bit about the use of this word "μήποτε" in the 2nd Tim passage is that it implies the expectation of a negative answer, though the speaker holds out some doubt about the negative answer...... AKA - you are EXPECTING that God will not grant repentance (because the people in question are not seeking it) - but you are holding out for the possibility that He May.... In the direct context of the entire passage (Which is about how you deal with headstrong people who love arguing and beating eachother down all the time) - this is the proper connotation.... That these people have no DESIRE for "Repentance" and so God probably won't force it on them - but there is a possibility that God may "Turn them around"....

  16. It's all about faith, or lack thereof.
  17. I agree - what I am trying to do is to share some of my own personal first hand experience on turning the thinking faith into action faith - Obedience.... How do you start to turn the "I know I need to repent" into actual act of Overcoming in real life....
  18. Blessings John!!! Always glad to read what you posted, some things are pretty deep, and that is a switch when they are deep, and make sense at the same time. Teaching deep things that make them seem simple has to be an ability given by God."

    First, the passage is about someone taken by Satan.............. We are not talking about your average confused person here. Dark spiritual blindness, caused by someone convincing themselves something is true when it's not, enforced by a real demonic spirit is a whole lot different than someone that just needs Jesus.

    The person knew truth, but through constantly violating their own conscience, it has become seered to where they forget what the Word said, as a man looking in the mirror forgeting what they looked like.

    So we have a heart issue and we have a Spiritual blindness issue here, captured by the devil.

    Now the question is.............. God is the Word, is God, the Same is God as the Word. The Word being alive, and powerful and seperates soul and spirit (Our thinking from spirit and right thinking)

    We give the Word to someone trapped by the devil...................

    We are anointed and the Word goes out in power. Something God said.

    Now, I am not saying Jesus is the Word part of God or 1/3 of a God machine, but the same is the Word is God.

    With the Power of the Holy Spirit and Word, would that not be more than enough to give someone enough light to make a right choice again?

    Since the Word never returns void, but accomplish the thing God sent it, then us instructing someone and taking authority over the enemy who captured that person, would that not be a for sure thing that the Person did get light and did get understanding and now can use that to recover themselves?

    When dealing with devils, and praise God we don't run into lots of posssessed or heavy oppressed folks (Not getting into the difference if the even be one) I always ask........ Do you want my help? I am anointed of God to help you.

    Just the basic understanding that they know they are messed up is all I need to gain entrance.

    When dealing with one possessed person who was screaming constantly about Satan and Jesus both being Lord, I first told the spirit to shut up and be still. Then when the persons mind was clear enough to hear me, I Said, I am anointed of God to help you, do you want to be free.

    I already knew the spirit was not longer confusing the person, now I need the person to want to be free. Thank God through tears he said yes.

    So, is not the Word of God and for sure thing in power?
    Remember, Tim is talking about someone actually captured by a devil. That is on another level.
  19. To repent is to just change your mind on the subject. So to put action to your feet, you have to persuade your heart that Jesus Christ did all that needed to be done to overcome and that you accept His way over yours. That's real repentance: when you are obedient because you know and believe it is the right thing to do. Not for any other reason, but for the love towards God and His righteousness.
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  20. When you study the written word of God you repent. When you listen to a message being taught you repent. Revelation of Gods word brings repentance every time. It changes our thinking and lines it up with How He thinks....
    Nanon and Abdicate say Amen and like this.

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