Automatic Promises and life is fixed

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Fish Catcher Jim, Aug 3, 2015.

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  1. I started this thread because many in here seem to think that all you have to do is get born again and all of Gods promises go to work in our lives automatically and what ever happens is Gods will for us.

    Hmm a no fault religion - what ever happens is not my fault for after all - you never know what God is going to do. That is so noty true !!

    So before I bring in scriptures and get going on this I wanted to hear from those who feel this is true and why as well as those who know better then this.
    Thank You and have a very blessed day
    Abdicate likes this.
  2. Deuteronomy 30:11-16,19-20
    11)For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. 12) it is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, who shall go up to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 13) Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it and do it? 14) BUT the Word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it. 16)In that I command thee this day to love the Lord thy God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments and His statutes and His judgements, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the Lord thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to posses it.
    19)I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that i have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live.
    20)That thou mayest love the Lord thy God, and that thou mayest obey His voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto Him: for He is thy life, and the length of thy days: that thou mayest dwell in the land which the Lord sware unto thy fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and to Jaob, to give them.

    Deuteronomy 29:29
    The secret things Belong unto the Lord our God: BUT those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children forever, that we may do all the Words of the law (or in our time Bible)
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  3. I agree with parts of the OP.

    All I know is that I don't think sin is ever the will of God. When we quench the Spirit this is not the will of God.

    God is completely sovereign and the choice to take a step back at times doesn't diminish this one bit. It is a sovereign choice.

    The will of God is to love and obey Him. If we aren't doing this it would be silly to say that we are in the will of God.
    Major likes this.
  4. Pavilion Hello,
    I wrote the OP and I do not agree with most of it. I am trying to draw in those who feel that suffering and trials and tribulations are Gods will as if we have to accept them as from God.
    Then I have a lot to say. ;)
    God Bless
  5. I don't think we have to accept them but sometimes they will come as an answer to our prayers. Eg God I want to be like Jesus... circumstances that will help us best cultivate this come. Or God I want to be used to bring many to salvation, then all sorts of obstacles come. In answering prayers these things will come. Just ask Jesus and Paul.
    We can pray for relief absolutely. But God's will may not be for relief at that time. It's never about circumstances as much as God's plan being accomplished and His glory displayed.
    KingJ likes this.
  6. Pavilion I am not sure I follow what you mean here.
    If you want to be more like Jesus then you get more word in you and learn to walk in the Spirit and not the flesh.

    Now satan will see to it that all sorts of stuff comes your way to hinder this. God is going to use His word to change you. Yes God can USE circumstances but He did not create them any more then He created obsticles for you to get over.

    It is NOT in God answering prayers thaty these things come but rather satan tyrying to keep you from receiving the answer to these prayers.
    God Bless
  7. Why don't we start with what exactly are God's promises to us?
    Major likes this.
  8. Agreed!
  9. #9 Major, Aug 4, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2015
    All you are doing is extending the thread we were talking on about whether or not trials/tesing comes from God or not which was "meaningless trials".

    That is no problem for me however the comments made will still be in effect which have already been stated.

    I believe that it is YOURposition that trials and testing do not come from God neither does He aloow them.

    But as I stated already, that is not what the Bible says.
    We can do more but here are a couple of verse that YOU will need to address.

    Jeremiah 17:10......
    "I, the Lord, SEARCH (EXAMINE) the HEART, I TEST the MIND, even to give to each man according to his ways, according to the results of his DEEDS."

    Job 23:10............
    "But HE (God) knows the way I take; when HE has TRIED ME [TESTED], I shall come forth as GOLD."

    Since the words are clearly there that God does indeed "TEST" us, how will you explain away their existance Jim????
  10. In many Christians' lives, the Lord has to step in and break off some very solid behaviours and desires in order for Him to shine through those lives. When He does that, it is called God's discipline, and it can actually hurt for a time, but in the end, we come through it all---shining with the radiance of the presence of Jesus Christ within.

    Hebrews 12:5-13
    And have you forgotten the encouraging words God spoke to you as his children? He said,

    “My child, don’t make light of the Lord’s discipline,
    and don’t give up when he corrects you.
    6 For the Lord disciplines those he loves,
    and he punishes each one he accepts as his child.”

    7 As you endure this divine discipline, remember that God is treating you as his own children. Who ever heard of a child who is never disciplined by its father? 8 If God doesn’t discipline you as he does all of his children, it means that you are illegitimate and are not really his children at all. 9 Since we respected our earthly fathers who disciplined us, shouldn’t we submit even more to the discipline of the Father of our spirits, and live forever?

    10 For our earthly fathers disciplined us for a few years, doing the best they knew how. But God’s discipline is always good for us, so that we might share in his holiness. 11 No discipline is enjoyable while it is happening—it’s painful! But afterward there will be a peaceful harvest of right living for those who are trained in this way.

    12 So take a new grip with your tired hands and strengthen your weak knees. 13 Mark out a straight path for your feet so that those who are weak and lame will not fall but become strong.
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  11. Does this bother you Major ? If so I apologise for that and remind you that you dont have to be here in this thread if you dont like it. ;)
    God Bless my friend
  12. Sounds good kj so bring them and lay them out.
  13. Not at all.
  14. Shew sure glad It came across wrong at first.
    Have a wonderful day and will respond later when I get back here.
    God Bless
  15. 2 Corinthians 1:20 (KJV)
    For all the promises of God in him [are] yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.​

    [I corrected your typos]

    Actually that's exactly what the word of God says:

    James 1:13 (KJV)
    Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:​

    Tempted: to try whether a thing can be done, to try, make trial of, test: for the purpose of ascertaining his quantity, or what he thinks, or how he will behave himself

    James 1:14-15 (KJV)
    But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. ​
    Cturtle, Euphemia and Fish Catcher Jim says Amen and like this.
  16. Again Brother I like it when you speak of His truth. Please dont back off and when you find time keep bringing His word in here. There are those who are wanting His truth and are getting it even with amongst those who insist on their own beliefs.
    God Bless
    Cturtle and Abdicate say Amen and like this.
  17. Right, As per the rules... if the subject changes, so as not to hijack Pancake's thread...
    Major likes this.
  18. Well before we can discuss promises we have to first understand faith. Faith isn't blind acceptance, that's foolishness. To the lost, God said:

    Isaiah 1:18 (KJV)
    Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool. ​

    Reason: to prove, decide, judge, rebuke, reprove, correct, be right, to be right (i.e. correct), reciprocal, to argue, causatively, to decide, justify or convict

    Even Jesus said:

    Luke 14:28 (KJV)
    For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have [sufficient] to finish [it]? ​

    Faith: conviction of the truth of anything, belief, a strong and welcome conviction or belief, belief with the predominate idea of trust (or confidence), the character of one who can be relied on

    Faith is literally to be fully persuaded:

    Romans 14:5 (KJV)
    One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day [alike]. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. ​

    How can one be persuaded about anything. Evidence. How many TV shows are there about gathering evidence to see if someone is guilty about something? How many debates are there on Global Warming? So the matter between our ears gathers up evidence from sources we TRUST and based on that information, we form a judgment and we pass that judgment to the heart and if the heart doesn't object, it becomes life to us. It become part of us and it becomes our belief. We own it.

    As physical beings we're absolute experts on the physical. I see a water balloon falling, we know right off that when it hits the ground it's going to go SPLAT. We learn all about gravity growing up. ALL our physical experiences are stored up and in a nanosecond we can pass judgement about something before our very eyes - rightly or wrongly - based on our life's experiences.

    When it comes to "things not seen" most have murdered their imagination after high school. Some still have it, but when's the last time you laid on the ground and tried to figure out the shapes of clouds flying by?

    Hebrews 11:1 (KJV)
    Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. ​

    Faith is the foundation (the meaning of substance) of... we build up a strong conviction based on the foundation of our experiences. But the word "things" is actually the meaning "that which has been done, a deed, an accomplished fact". So far, the meaning of this verse is:

    The strong conviction of an accomplished fact/deed for which we HOPE for, the evidence (a proof, that by which a thing is proved or tested, conviction, verdict) of an accomplished fact/deed not seen (to see, discern, of the bodily eye).

    So see, faith isn't blind trust, but trust based on the evidence of an accomplished fact which we cannot see with the eye - meaning the physical.

    The world understands this and is indeed 100% part of every motivational speaker. Just how many books, both secular and Christian start with "How to ____ in 21 days." When I was in the military, I really wanted a marksman title. I had been shooting most of my young life, we sighted rifles for our neighbors so I knew a thing or two about guns. I had two chances to get it. The first time I did it I blew it. The instructor asked me, "what do I need to do to get the marksman title?" I replied, "I had to hit the center target with all 60 rounds." He said, so, close your eyes, go through it in your head and SEE the outcome with 60 holes in the center target." I did and I got the title. I knew I could shoot. I knew what needed to be done. I believed and became fully persuaded by seeing the desired outcome in my mind.

    Faith is the harmonization of thought, emotions and deep feelings. You brain (thoughts) is your judgement center. Emotions are the feelings being affected by your surroundings. Deep feelings are those down in your heart that are unmovable - right or wrong. If you had a horrendous event with a person named "Frank", every time you hear that name you invoke a strong negative feeling. If you had a loving wonderful mother, every time you hear about your mother, you invoke a strong positive feeling. These are all stored judgements of your brain that was accepted by your heart. This is the who in who you are. When your thoughts, emotions and feelings are in harmony you have faith about something.

    Remember something else about faith. Doubt is not the absence of faith. Doubt is the persuasion and deep belief in the evidence that is contrary to faith. Our problem isn't we don't have enough faith, our problem is our attention is on the evidence that proves it's not going to happen. When I have my attention on the evidence that says "I'm never going to get out of this," that's what doubt is. Faith is when I have my eyes on the evidence that says "I'm coming out of this!" This is how one becomes fully persuaded.

    That's enough for now. Without this foundation (substance) you'll not understand the promises. Off to bed...
    Major, Fish Catcher Jim and Euphemia says Amen and like this.
  19. Test, Trials, Disciplining, Tempt…. they are different words…

    TEMPT is a negative word: it’s intention/context is DESTRUCTIVE
    DISCPLINE is a positive word: it’s intention/context is CONSTRUCTIVE​

    Language is fluid, it can be shaped how one use it...
    Test and Trials, depending on how it is used: can be made into context of TEMPT
    Test and Trials, depending on how it is used: can be made into context of DISCIPLINE….​

    I think we apply Principle of Love: "believes all things, hopes all things"
    That is: we ought to think that a Christian brother or sister is of good intention, a loving intention when the word is used….

    In Logic, Philosophy, there is that concept of Principle of Charity

    Principle of charity
    We make maximum sense of the words and thoughts of others when we interpret in a way that optimises agreement.
    KingJ likes this.
  20. Intentions leave you fallen short.
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