Are You Watching Or Being Foolish?

Discussion in 'Bible Study' started by Stan, Aug 21, 2013.

  1. Matthew 25:1-13 ONE of the Olivet parables/prophecies.

    What exactly is Jesus saying by this parable?
    What does it mean to have our lamps trimmed and filled with oil?
    What are we supposed to be watching for and why?
  2. Welll.....Should we not first see the surrounding verses before and after?

    What was He preaching about?

    I see in the chapter before, separation of people from other people, a winnowing, an Event that changes claimants from actuals.

    Would not He be speaking along the same lines in this parable?
  3. No doubt they all go together as Jesus taught them all at the same time, but I think there is a specific message to this section of scripture. Verses 14-30 is a different parable showing a different outcome, one of productiveness with the gifts God has given us, whatever they may be.
    I have NO answers on this. I am willing to learn with all those who want to examine this scripture.
    My questions were sincere, NOT loaded ones.
  4. Well.....Can't recall any "loaded questions" from you, Stan.

    Let's look at the results of the surrounding parables both in the 24 chapter and the one you mention in 25: 14~30 as well as the virgins waiting for the Bridegroom:

    Servants, virgins....not unbeleivers....
  5. Matthew 25:4
    " but the prudent took oil in flasks along with their lamps."

    IMO, I will equate Lamp, with Light, with good deeds, with Love…

    Thus, not only our dealing with people filled with Love, but to carry on for extra mile = Patience.

    If we are teachers: patience to teach….

    If we are students: to exert effort to listen.

    If we are parent: it is easy to provide material things…. what is more loving is spending time with them..

    I read somewhere that evil is equated with idleness… being lazy….rather than pride.

    I tend to agree…. Love is an effort.
  6. On a side note:
    I think there is a world of difference between a false teacher…… and a student who heard a false teaching, seeking confirmation...and a student who heard a false teaching trying to teach : )

    That is, with loving teachers here in this forum to extend time, patience and effort to correct…
    Precisely why I think teachers will be judge more strictly….

    James 3:1
    “My brethren, let not many of you become teachers, knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgment”
  7. #7 Rusty, Aug 21, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2013
    Sweet thought/sentiment,,,,but where is your biblical evidence that oil (the real point of the symbolism) means "love"?

    There just over 200 times that "oil" is used as a symbol, and allegory or a literal thing in the Word....none say or hint or allude to oil being "love" far as I can see.

    "Lamp" is use only 13 times, and this one and a few others seem to me to convey what God means by the symbol:

    Help me out aha...what is your Bible evidence?
  8. I equate the LAMP with LIGHT with LOVE
    I think the oil symbolizes nothing (in the parable at least)
    … it is the effort of the prudent that is being symbolized….

    The reason i put it in red: because what the OP mentioned is lamp is filled only... there is a flask/vessel carried for the extra oil....
  9. I ask again....where in the Word is this equation of yours located? I can't find it.
  10. #10 aha, Aug 21, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2013
    which one: OIL?

    i equate the LAMP with LIGHT, then GOOD DEEDS, then LOVE.

    ok, not OIL, sorry because you said ask again...

    ok here it is:

    Matthew 5:14
    14 “You are the light of the world. A city set on a [f]hill cannot be hidden; 15 nor does anyone light a lamp and put it under a [g]basket, but on the lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house. 16 Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.
  11. I know what you are saying....But where is your Bible PROOF of this?

    If you don't have any, that's OK, then this is just a personal opinion, which may float your boat, but is it not based what we are doing....a Bible study...which requires Bible back up, see?

    I showed that God says His Word is a lamp.

  12. Yep I see the distinction. Jesus was talking to His disciples so I would assume He would use people they could relate to such as other believers.
    My understanding is that type of event or ritual was normal for Jewish weddings. They were held at night and the virgins would lead the bridegroom to where the Bride was so they needed well trimmed lamps. I also see that the groom being delayed is evident today in the delay of Jesus' return.

    I think one aspect is in verse 1 where Jesus says; "At THAT time, the kingdom of heaven will be LIKE 10 Virgins...., 5 wise and 5 foolish."
    So how are believers wise and foolish based on this parable?

    Unprepared. Lack of fore-thought. The difference is the foolish did NOT take extra oil. To have that responsibility and NOT prepare for every eventuality, is termed foolish by Jesus. The responsibility was to light the way for the groom to where the Bride was. It is a given He didn't know where that was, but is that important or is their lighting the way the ONLY issue here?
    Maybe the issue is that the 5 foolish we locked out of the wedding? After all they could get to the wedding with only 5 lamps one would presume. Verse 12 and 13 seems rather harsh, but IF you take the view that the 5 foolish virgins were not real believers, but only went along as a lark , a thing to do or peer pressure, then it would seem, that their commitment to do this thing was NOT genuine and the groom realized this when they weren't there to greet him.
  13. But Stan....The servants parables WERE spoken to the disciples as well as the virgins verses: See Matt 24:3.

    Servants, virgins, family (see Matt 12:48,49), friends (John 15:14)....Christ used many labels for believers.


    Yes...the Jewish wedding practices are part of the parable. But let's not get so literal here: are all Christians virgins? No. So what is He telling us? What type of virgins could these represent?
  14. Yes I see that, but it doesn't mean it represented ONLY believers. Maybe the first thing to establish is WHAT is the kingdom of heaven? We need to keep within the context of the Olivet discourses.
    I don't know why Jesus used VIRGINS for the people in this parable, other than it was the common practice of the day to do so. I'm sure their virginal status is irrelevant. Maybe you see something I don't?
  15. Yes I do see the virgin status as VERY significant.
    First to the Jewish mind a young maiden, a virgin, is the highest example of pure love and undivided devotion. In the OT, a non-virgin man was no big deal, no laws were imposed against him in the Mosaic laws (that I am aware of) BUT the defiled non virgin woman is a symbol of all thinks evil, divisive and unfaithful (Jezebel, Delilah etc.)

    Therefore, Christ I think is using this example of the pure undivided lovers of Christ's return very pointedly. However, he is also underlining that these very devoted "virgins" are some not so wise and some wise...I see this as pointing to His Church. The virgins point to His People in these last days.

    So all we need to see is what the lamp and oil represent, then we can see the meaning of who was foolish and why.
  16. There may also be a significance to Rev 7 and 14 where the male virgins are called out to witness to Israel, by I digress.
  17. Yes there is a definite connection, but I do not see this as a sexual matter even there. comment on my last post?
  18. Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by NOT a sexual matter. That is exactly what a virgin is. NO sexual activity.

    I didn't see anything else that needed or required commenting on Rusty.
  19. Ok...let's back up....What do you see the symbolic meaning is of the parable of the 10 virgins?
    Is it about just actually 10 sexually innocent girls waiting for Jesus or something much broader?
    Will there be in the future only be literally 10 sexually innocent girls waiting for the return of Christ?
    You do see the Bridegroom as Christ, I gather?
  20. To me they are representative of believers waiting for Jesus' return. He calls them wise and foolish.
    What is of more import to me is WHAT the Kingdom of Heaven is? It is ONLY used in Matthew.
    Yes the groom I see as Christ, but that does raise an interesting point. Who is the Bride?

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