Are Women Allowed To Speak In Church?

Discussion in 'Evangelism' started by little flower, May 9, 2013.

  1. Precisely, HMS. This is the main reason that throughout my membership I've tried to point out that Hebrew cultural minutia and panoramas are very different from modern Western man's per-conceived and church based ideas.

    To know the context does NOT take away from the Word's worth, but often DOES unplug modern Christendom's suppositions.

    I cite the Antebellum South in the States, a highly Christianized society, and it's ideas about slavery.

    I cite all of Europe, which for endless centuries demanded the "divine right of kings", as a God ordained requirement of absolute rule.
     
  2. It gets so tedious seeing people rant about what they "think" scripture does or does not say.

    The whole point is not that " da broads should oughta keep der moufs shut", but that there are roles for the 2 genders that should be adhered to. A woman was not to be in a position of authority over a man, (and a man was not to abuse his authority over a woman). Whether or not Paul's comments were universal in scope or were meant to be applied to those at that time is up for debate. In church history there have been thousands of women that God has spoken to directly and has used for His purpose, often in opposition to the male authorities of the time and locale.

    Rusty's point of considering culture when meditating on scripture should not be dismissed. There is no shortage of foolishness that comes from modern folks looking at ancient behavior with modern eyes.
     
    LysanderShapiro, Milena and Rusty says Amen and like this.
  3. Righto, Glo.

    I tried to give evidence of church history in my post #23....which was brushed aside....
     
  4. @ Grappler: do you believe in strict adherence to the 'law' (scripture) else punishment be administered immediately?

    Thanks.
     
  5. What??:confused:
     
  6. This is one of "those" issues. Great Christian warriors, brilliant Biblical scholars, and theologians of every ilk have debated and argued this since the dawn of Christianity as an independent religion. I never quite understand why people seem to believe that THEY are the ones that hold the final truth, and that this truth can be battered out of other believers. While I constantly hear the excuse that it helps us develop our own beliefs, I never seem to see that. I see swords clashing, but it as two boulders yelling insults at each other in the hopes that one will eventually turn into a pillow.

    Where it really crosses the line, is when I start hearing accusations of false Christianity. Seriously, stop acting like children. It's unworthy, it's immature, and since this is the evangelism area, anyone involved in this poop-slinging exercise should really consider an evening of prayer and reconciliation with why you think your person opinions are so much more important than showing respect for your fellow believers. What I'm seeing here is not an attempt to help the OP understand anything, but an attempt to force feed your personal agendas. Stop it. Stop it now and the money changers in the temple will consider themselves fortunate that they got off so easily.
     
    Grappler likes this.
  7. LOL Banarenth, Good rant ^_^

    I'm just going to case in point here.
    Joyce Meyers is a preacher, she says she talks to God. Enough said, if you believe she is telling the truth
    when she says she talks to God there is your evidence, according to her, God hasn't told her to shhhh yet. Unless you are prepared to jump out and call Joyce Meyers a liar?
     
    SparkleEyes likes this.
  8. Well ofcourse it is possible that she is lying but that is between her and God. But as far as female preachers....I prefer to stand with scripture on that issue and no one on here has still been able to say that I am in the wrong for believing that women should not pastor or preach in a church. I find it amusing how people get all fussy over this issue. If you want to attend a church that has a woman pastor that is your right...it is my right to say that I don't think it is right. :)
     
  9. Ive heard an argument that it is a translation thing, it doesn't say ''women should keep quiet'' blah blah
    in the original texts.

    Also didn't someone use the there is no black white, male female blah blah argument?

    Sorry for the 'blah blahs' I'm not a scripture warrior
     
  10. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
     
    Rusty likes this.
  11. @ Tjon

    We are spiritual beings-in a physical world. We are 'multidimensional' if you will. BUT God has a process and a purpose for everything. We are created in the physical and grow into the spiritual. While we learn to transition through the 2, we need the Lord to Guide us (the Holy Spirit) to Good. We still have to 'play by the rules' God set forth in this life. It is our way of showing God our love for Him through our obeisance no matter what gender or role we play out in this world.

    The next world will be slightly different.....:D
     
  12. You're ignoring the fact that there are translation issues on the matter.
     
  13. Yes the same man who said women should keep quiet in the assembly. Don't take this wrong but maybe you should show a little more respect for scripture and take the time to look it up instead of your little blah blahs....just saying.;)
     
  14. The fact??lol I think you mean more like your opinion. Here are some facts..... 1 Timothy 2:12 "I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet."NIV "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."KJV "But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet."NASV And my personal study bible the ESV says "I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet." Just believe and obey scripture my friend and you will be fine.(y)
     
  15. Acts 2.17-18 In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophecy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams. Even on my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days and they will prophecy.

    Of course no one is saying women should not be in subjection with men but as women are saved, filled with the Holy Spirit and they are here described as prophesying, they are equally gifted by God.
     
    svdbyJesus likes this.
  16. I was wondering all of this myself... I didn't read all the comments because a lot of it looked more like arguments rather than scriptural based discussion. what about the women in the bible who were prophetess'? why are there so many important women in the bible who were so much more than just a figure that took care of the home and children? how are women supposed to train up their daughters/younger women if they really aren't supposed to "preach" or even learn... it doesn't say for men to teach the young women. how was Deborah a judge if women were to be quiet? what about the unmarried women? when it said "for God is not the author of confusion...." is he referring to all that was said previously when talking about speaking in tongues, or was he saying that about "women must keep silence in church..."? do all versions of the bible say the same thing about all this?

    we do not know who God has called to preach/teach/prophesy...we can't say God did not call that person!! so if we shout false prophet just because it may be a woman, are we being ignorant or is it justified? is the only thing that changed after Christ's crucifixion is our way of salvation?

    im not trying to be rude, just would like some questions answered. so many laws changed throughout the Bible.
     
  17. There are thoughts and arguments on each side of this. It is an issue that deeply divides believers for sure. However, as a woman I have taught my children as best as I could but they are grown up now, I work full time to support my husband and provide for my family and I read the Bible every day and seek The Lord. The Bible does have some scriptures as quoted by others about women keeping silent in church and not being in authority over men. It also commends women active in serving the purposes of God and so the matter cannot be driven forward just on isolated verses alone.

    However, I feel God is urging me to share my faith with others and do the work of an evangelist. I would never do this without the agreement and support of my husband or my Pastor. Maybe women should pray that more men get a calling from God to share the gospel - to our Sunday school children, one to one and street preaching but until that happens, if God can speak through a donkey, cause stones to praise Him, any child of God will have to preach the gospel.
     
    svdbyJesus and ~forgiven_not_forsaken~ say Amen and like this.
  18. I've noticed that if you go to churches outside of the western culture, you will see them being more concerned with biblical church attributes.
     
  19. Is it possible that Paul was a proponent in giving credence to prevailing authority as a strategy to spread the gospel, establish the church, and secure the Christian faith in many regions?

    I would predict that if Paul were alive today in these United States he would not endorse lawful slavery or the lawful subservient treatment of women.
    Why?
    Its illegal in the United States to do so, as Paul honored the general premise of the law.

    Must every word that proceeded from Paul become "a new law" where we as the body become the laws newly acquired subordinates once again? Was not the old law a temporary custodian at best? Or should we instead be subordinate to the Spirit that moved Paul's pen within a specific culture, in a specific government, and with specific customs during perilous times?

    Thus women and slaves by Roman law were treated slightly better than dogs unto extreme despotism. I would advocate that in these United States that the Bill of Rights has elevated every persons individual status in "Natural Rights" as "equal." I would also advocate that Natural Rights is born form Genesis and precedes all civil governments. I would then presuppose that Paul would reverence our Government in the same way he did with the brutal totalitarian Roman government, but with a new found gladness that despotism is reduced.

    Is not "church membership also a voluntary contract in these United States?" For if a woman joins a church were women are to be silent, are to sit in the back, cover their heads, and then only ask their husband questions about the message after, then I would reflect "one should honor the voluntary contract in that church." However if one then feels that this is a mistreatment unto their own convictions, then its better to join another church who supports a woman’s involvement than to stir up strife in the church who stands rigid to silence regarding women.Yet I advise no one to action and simply reflect my own convictions.

    For no force is administered by any church to silence women in these United States lest they become despotic brutes then thrashing ethics and just-law into the ditch. Yet voluntary contracts are in great variance for today’s opportunity. I am indeed an advocate of "honoring the church we contract with." I am also a proponent of Natural Rights Theory from scripture that would give "human beings" the delegation of natural equality the same, which includes all women.
     
  20. I know this is an old thread, but it doesn't seem like it was ever appropriately answered so i'll chime in. READ THE WHOLE CHAPTER! Yep...that is about all that needs to be said...this whole culture argument isn't the answer, idk where that came about, the answer is literally the next verse showing that Paul was being sarcastic...duh! I guess I am just blessed to have basic reading comprehension? Really though, shouldn't it go off in your heads anyways that something doesn't seem right and maybe your interpretation is off? If something contradicts your intuitions your radar should go off that something isn't right and you need to look deeper, but honestly I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of the people who held this view just heard it at a church they go to holding this belief and they never bothered questioning what the church told them. Where are the Be like the Bereans people! Examine scripture and it's context!
     

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