goldenroad

Does anyone know?

Theophilus

Building a tower(away to heaven) in the bible just like they did in Genisis. Not with stone and morter mind you, But with christianity and theology. And it is God's confounding the languages that keeps causing it to crumble and fall.

The closer we look with a microscope at anything including the scriptures the less we can see of the universe.


They only perform autopsies on the dead because if they do so to the living it will kill them.

Hold a bible close enough to your face and it becomes an obsticle that you cannot see or get over or around.

What I'm saying here is don't get so involved with the count and color of the pixels that you miss the whole picture.


Sincerely
Cliff

Boanerges

There is only One with the power to create:


This is the definition of evil according to Strongs Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible:
H7451
רעה רע
ra‛ râ‛âh
rah, raw-aw'
From H7489; bad or (as noun) evil (naturally or morally). This includes the second (feminine) form; as adjective or noun: - adversity, affliction, bad, calamity, + displease (-ure), distress, evil ([-favouredness], man, thing), + exceedingly, X great, grief (-vous), harm, heavy, hurt (-ful), ill (favoured), + mark, mischief, (-vous), misery, naught (-ty), noisome, + not please, sad (-ly), sore, sorrow, trouble, vex, wicked (-ly, -ness, one), worse (-st) wretchedness, wrong. [Including feminine ra’ah; as adjective or noun.]


Here are over 30 translations to compare:

Isa 45:7
(ACV) I form the light, and create darkness. I make peace, and create evil. I am LORD who does all these things.

(ASV) I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil. I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.

(BBE) I am the giver of light and the maker of the dark; causing blessing, and sending troubles; I am the Lord, who does all these things.

(Bishops) It is I that created light and darknesse, I make peace and trouble: yea euen I the Lorde do all these thinges.

(CEV) I create light and darkness, happiness and sorrow. I, the LORD, do all of this.

(Complete Apostles' Bible) I am He that prepared light, and formed darkness; who makes peace, and creates calamity; I am the Lord God, that does all these things.

(Darby) forming the light and creating darkness, making peace and creating evil: I, Jehovah, do all these things.

(DRB) I form the light, and create darkness, I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord that do all these things.

(ESV) I form light and create darkness, I make well-being and create calamity, I am the LORD, who does all these things.

(Geneva) I forme the light and create darkenes: I make peace and create euill: I the Lorde doe all these things.

(GNB) I create both light and darkness; I bring both blessing and disaster. I, the LORD, do all these things.

(GSB) der ich das Licht mache und die Finsternis schaffe; der ich Frieden gebe und Unglück schaffe. Ich, der HERR, tue solches alles.

(GW) I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, the LORD, do all these things.

(HOT)יוצר אור ובורא חשׁך עשׂה שׁלום ובורא רע אני יהוה עשׂה כל־אלה׃
(HOT+)יוצר3335 אור216 ובורא1254 חשׁך2822 עשׂה6213 שׁלום7965 ובורא1254 רע7451 אני589 יהוה3068 עשׂה6213 כל3605 אלה׃428


(ICE) Ég tilbý ljósið og framleiði myrkrið, ég veiti heill og veld óhamingju. Ég er Drottinn, sem gjöri allt þetta.

(JPS) I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.

(KJ2000)I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create calamity: I the LORD do all these things.

(KJV+TVM) I form3335[8802] the light216, and create1254[8802] darkness2822: I make6213[8802] peace7965, and create1254[8802] evil7451: I the LORD3068 do6213[8802] all these things .
(KJV+) I form3335 the light,216 and create1254 darkness:2822 I make6213 peace,7965 and create1254 evil:7451 I589 the LORD3068 do6213 all3605 these428things.

(KJV-1611) I forme the light, and create darkenesse: I make peace, and create euill: I the Lord do all these things.

(KJVA) I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

(KJVR) I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Boanerges

(LITV) forming light, and creating darkness; making peace, and creating evil. I, Jehovah, do all these things.

(MKJV) forming the light and creating darkness; making peace and creating evil. I Jehovah do all these things.

(Rev. Webster+) I form3335 [8802] the light216, and create1254 [8802] darkness2822: I make6213 [8802] peace7965, and create1254 [8802] evil7451: I the LORD3068 do6213 [8802] all these things.
(RV) I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil;
I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.
(The Scriptures '98+) forming light and creating darkness, making peace and creating evil. I, יהוה, do all these.’

(UPDV) I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil. I am Yahweh, that does all these things.

(Vulgate) formans lucem et creans tenebras faciens pacem et creans malum ego Dominus faciens omnia haec

(Webster) I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

(YLT) Forming light, and preparing darkness, Making peace, and preparing evil, I am Jehovah, doing all these things.'

I hope that helps- many blessings Larry

Bassmasa

What a great question! I don't pretend to know the mind of God, but being a parent is as close as I'll probably ever get. I love my son more than anything, short of God. But, I let him make mistakes. He has free will and will simply make bad choices from time to time. (Keep in mind he's only 2...but still ). I don't want him to make mistakes, but at the same time, they provide ways for us to grow closer. If he was perfect, why would he need his Mom & Dad? This does not justify original sin (or any sin), but maybe helps us understand free will a bit more.

Keep in mind that God created us simply for His pleasure. He doesn't need us and can create whatever the heck He sees fit. But...He did! When we recognize our faults and our failings, we have no choice but to fall on our knees and praise Him for His forgiveness and grace. Through repentance, we truly grow to know God.

Unfortunately, after Adam & Eve ate the apple, mankind was separated from God. Obviously, God knew this would happen...but why? Thousands of years later, God sent Christ as our salvation. Without Christ, we cannot know the Father and have no hope. Without original sin and if we were in perfect harmony with God, Christ's sacrifice would not be necessary. So, to bring this all together, God allowed original sin and evil into the world precisely so His glory could be revealed to mankind through Christ, a man Himself!

I'm kind of rambling, too, but God allowed His perfect plan to be ruined by man for His own glory...how's that for a mind bender?

Boanerges

Joh 1:1 In1722 the beginning746 was2258 the3588 Word,3056 and2532 the3588 Word3056 was2258 with4314 God,2316 and2532 the3588 Word3056 was2258 God.2316 Joh 1:2 The same3778 was2258 in1722 the beginning746 with4314 God.2316 Joh 1:3 All things3956 were made1096 by1223 him;846 and2532 without5565 him846 was not3761 any thing1520 made1096 that3739 was made.1096 NOTHING WAS CREATED THAT JESUS DID NOT CREATE HIMSELF-THERE IS NO DENYING THAT- WHAT WE DID WITH THOSE THINGS IS WERE OUR CHOICE COMES IN.Rev 13:8 And2532 all3956 that dwell2730 upon1909 the3588 earth1093 shall worship4352 him,846 whose3739 names3686 are not3756 written1125 in1722 the3588 book976 of life2222 of the3588 Lamb721 slain4969 from575 the foundation2602 of the world.2889 THE LAMB SLAIN FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD- GOD HAD PLANNED REDEMPTION ( FROM SIN AND EVIL) BEFORE CREATION- THERE IS NOTHING THAT CAN TAKE HIM BY SURPRISE- ALL THE ABOVE ARE SCRIPTURAL FACTS THE FOLLOWING IS MY OPINION- WHEN GOD SAYS IT IT IS ALREADY DONE- HE SPOKE THE UNIVERSE INTO EXISTANCE- BUT JUST BECAUSE IT IS ALREADY DONE DOESN'T MEAN WE HAVE SEEN IT MANIFEST IN THE NATURAL YET FOR GOD LIVES OUTSIDE OF TIME- HE IS YESTERDAY- HE IS TODAY- HE IS TOMMOROW- GOD ALWAYS IS- AND HE KNOWS THE BEGGINING FROM THE END- THAT IS WERE THE " THOSE HE FOREKNEW HE PREDESTINATED PART FITS IN- HE ALREADY KNOWS OUR CHOICES AND MAKES PLANS ACCORDINGLY- YES HE IS THE CREATOR OF ALL- YES HE GIVES US MANY CHOICES- AND YES HE MAKES PROVISION FOR OUR EVERY CIRCUMSTANCE- THERE IS INDEED GOOD AND EVIL THE ONLY QUESTION LEFT THEN IS WHAT WILL WE PERSONALLY CHOOSE ?

God-Sent

God could make us all love Him.

He loved us enough though to give us free will to choose...If Lucifer was stopped then we would have had no free will to choose to follow or not to follow God's instructions.

__________________
""I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis"

goldenroad

My point though is why did there have to be evil in the first place. We would have naturally chosen to follow God in the absence of evil. I don't even know what i'm saying anymore. I've got so many questions garbled up in my head and no definite answer or means of an answer.

Why does evil have to exist? My only thought is that it is a force uncontrolled by God (thanks Boanerges for the scriptures but the definition of evil seems to jump back and forth) which makes no sense to me but if it is controlled by God then why does it exist?

gus4pm

I think it is fare to say that every christian at times battles with this thought, me daily!
I have to say I do not know the total truth to many things in this world or Gods. however as theophilis said above don't get caught up on it. Don't let it be your stumbling block. There are many things God does that I have to say; "Well I'm just going to have to trust you on that one today God" (Just because I don't see the good big picture does not mean it is not there)

To me there is no other way, either 1) Trust in God for Him to know what He is doing and that latter on you will be in on the info with Him
or 2) Doubt that God knows what He is doing and that things may be unfair /and because things don't make sense I'm going to not serve my master to the fullest

Embrace God and hope!

Boanerges

An important thing to remember but God is soveriegn and nothing is outside of His control- we may not understand everything He does but we can be at peace knowing He is wise and does everything for a good reason. I am not sure what you mean about the definition but thats ok- God never wanted robots if there was nothing to choose between what would the difference be between us and them -I find peace in knowing the Master works all for the good- I hope you get the resolution you need on this matter- many blessings- Larry