Jonathan Hili

I've started this post because, as a Christian, I'm interested to hear what others think of scientific developments and theories in the light of Christianity (of vice versa).

For instance:

1. What do you all think of the Big Bang theory as a hypothesis for the beginning of the universe?

2. What do you think of evolution? Do you think that it fits in well with scripture or doesn't it?

3. However has scientific knowledge improved or changed your understanding of scripture, the world and God?

Cheers.

M Paul

My problem is, that I've had this conversation so many times, it's hard to keep an interest in going over it again and again. Why don't you set out your view on these issues first, and then if you have a unique angle, maybe, something can get going.

M Paul

frylok

Big bang theory is being accepted among most astro-physicists as the best hypothesis as to the universe's origins, but most of those scientists speculate that this was not the first big bang, the second, third, or even the last one. Many beleive it is how the universe lives, expanding and contracting, dying and rebirth. Coupled with basic metaphysical, astro-physical concepts, and the law of thermodynamics, the laws of the conservation of energy, it fits to be the perfect explanation of how the universe began (again)

Evolution- also being widely accepted among scientists as not a theory, but a scientfic fact base from all the research. More people can instantly prove evolution exists using true-to-life models and just simple common sense when mapping genes.

Scripture- I think it can all fit together compatabally, but everyone is so gung-ho about being anti-whatever, that no comprehensive understanding of how the two origins of man can coexist and live in harmony. Perhaps both are true and we're just so concerned with one or the other that we blind ourselves from true understanding. I mean, if in twenty years evolution will be a fact, we as Christians better start to understand why we fear 'evolution' so much.

Do we really think that the Bible is going to stay the same for the rest of existence? What about after the rapture? What about after the end times? What if the end times keeps goin on until its the new times, will we still use the exact same Bible, or will God send messengers down to write the new chapters? Is the Bible complete? How do we know for sure?

Evolution and the Big bang havn't changed my view on scripture. Well, when I was ten I believed we could all come from two individuals, but as I studied, and realized that humanity needs a much larger gene-pool than that to pass its genes on to the next generation without deformities, I relized tht life sometimes just isn't as simple as I want it to be....

cnpaul

Dear Jonathan Hili,
Your post raises an interesting question. I have a lot about it but my English is limited.

I go to churches for about 8 years. I try to find the answer of many questions by Bible. What is human? What is the human relationship with God?
On the other hand, I tryied to study science for about 30 years. From math to phys to astronomy. So I try to be honest.

I would say God is perfect but human is always sinful in every aspect of life including science. Science is only one part of life by which human is connected to the creation of God. God is real but the human knowledge of its creation may not be the real reflection of the creation.

That is why science is always progressing: modification, new results, new fields. If so, why should we always trust in Big Bang. My simple theory of the model of the universe is more consistent, more aethetic than BB. That is, it is better than Big Bang. Honestly say, in the academic circle, human authority practises suppression. No other contention is allowed. All are human!

God's creation is real, is up there! I have to leave the circle after 30 yrs. I am considering to open a website, to distribute contendable knowledge, to distribute the message: knowledge is human's partial perception to God's real creation. Human sinful nature is still in the perception!

da_man

Doesn't it seem odd, though, that if the big bang theory were true that our planet just happened to have everything right to support life. I would think that one of the other planets in our solar system would have something close to what we've got. Granted the big bang encompasses the whole universe but if we are going to talk about chance.....
As for evolution doesn't it say in the Bible that God created man in the image of Himself? And why would evolution only happen during a certain period of time. If evolution were true there should be people coming out of the ocean or jungle or something like that everyday.

da_man

I agree wholeheartedly. Everything happens through God. So if the big bang were to take place (lol) it was still controlled by God. If evolution were to have taken place (rofl) it was controlled by God.

templaris

If evolution were true would we have people comeing out of the jungle and oceans everyday?

If the big bang theory were true, how come we just so happened to land perfectly in the only spot avaliable to sustain life, what are those odds, like one in a million?


This is the comment that urks me. How are we as Christians supposed to have our claims and supports taken seriously if ideas like the one above are actually BELIEVED by us?

no, evolution doesnt take place everyday, but is a slow process that takes millions and millions of years and continues on for millions of years until extinction.

our earth is lined up perfectly in the sun's orbit to support life, but considering how big the universe is, and the trillions and TRILLIONS of stars, galaxies, solar systems and planets in the universe, it is relatively bu numbers, EASY to have one just in the right moment of time and space to support life, and infact, by this premis, the idea of life on other planets is a statistical fact, that there has to be life besides ours, just because of how huge the universe truely is.

yes, monkeys are still evolving. Insects, are still evolving. Moths that used to live in the forrest that now live in the cities turned from brown to white, to adapt their camoflauge (brown tree-bark, then white buildings took theur enviornment, so they had to adapt to their surroundings for survival. proof that adaptation is a small aspect of evolution)


the big bang and evolution hasnt impacted my belief in Christ one bit, but if anything, supports Christ in my eyes.


lol on a side note....i watched an episode of family guy, and God lit a fart on fire, and thus, the big bang....this was funny to me, and in ways inclined me to believe both science and religion can live in harmony, both accepting each oter as truthful.

da_man

I agree that science and religion can live together but I think we have to be careful not to take it to far. The Bible says that God created the heavens and earth. So the big bang could have taken place but I think God still controlled. He created our orbit and planet in such a way that life would be supported. And he created life. Is it just coincidence that creatures on this planet can have 2 cells meet up and eventually create a living breathing person. Look at what takes place in a person's body and tell me that isn't intelligent design.
I believe in survival of the fittest. Animals will adapt to their surroundings. Like you mentioned about the moths. I agree that things like that happen. But to say that man evolved from monkeys or from some creature from the sea I think is wrong. The Bible says that God create man out of his own likeness. I don't think God is a fish or a monkey.
Finally, I think science and religion can compliment each other very well if we keep each in it's proper place.

Jonathan Hili

Thanks for the great replies.

My own perspective is that science tends to compliment scripture very well. I'm not much of an astronomer, but Big Bang theory sounds sensible and would be a very appropriate way for God to begin it all.

templaris

Sceince and religion will always be at each other's throats for control I suppose. But the true test lies within our faith, how how our faith must be stronger than either science, OR religion. Faith is not the same thing as religion, nor is logic/sensibility the same thing as science, but they all have a link between each other as a symbiotic relationship with a very complex structure.

When people present me with the fact of the Bible saying God created us out of His image is quite the relavent point; why would God be a fish that turns into a human? I dont think thats necessarily what God meant when He said "His image". He is infinity, first and foremost. Two things we as finite beings have in common with a being of infinity is only energy, and levels of energy. Yes, this is chemistry physics, but I think its valid. Scientists can point out that energy is nothing but mass that has been sped to the speed of light, and mas is nothing but energy that has slowed. Yes, sure, this all goes with the theory of relativity, how energy is only mass and speed of light squared, and you can alwys balance the equation by saying mass is just the negative speed of energy. So really, all things, man, mammal, fish, tree, plant, dirt, rock, all have energy and mass in common. This leads me to believe that God is infinitely all masses and energies at every speed that He fueled from himself, leading me to believe God is everything, all at once, including man, mammal, and fish. To say we were created out of His image can go hand-in-hand with my theory that God includes everything, including man and rocks and trees, etc, while still being a sentient being of His own free will.

but this theory only works if the specific passage is "man was created OUT of His image," instead of "in His image". From within, or from without, were we made? does that even matter though? I don't know, but its certainly worth thinking about.

What versions of the Bible say "man was created out of his image", and which ones say "...created from His image" or "...created in his image." I know debating the meanings of in, out and from could be quite moot, as they are all prepositions just so.

but this is how I believe in evolution, science, AND the Bible all at once. I believe we were created out of His image but only if that image is an image of infinity, something we as hmans cannot begin to comprehend, which is why I do not hold too much stock in science, OR religion, but rather, put all of my stock in faith alone.