PreciousMessage

Replying to your texts:

The text quoted does show the lofty and exalted position of “the church” in the last days; but those who are so zealously laboring for that end should remember that “the day of the Lord of hosts,” which immediately follows such a union of church and State, “shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low.” “And the loftiness of man shall be bowed down, and the haughtiness of men shall be made low; and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.” Verse 12, 17.

The Lord does not say, "Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD" the people do. There is no invitation from the Lord.

This is the result toward which those look who shout, “The world for Christ.” Notice, the scripture does not say that people will actually walk in the law of the Lord, but that “many people shall go and say” that certain things shall take place. That this national Christianity will be only a sham, an outside show, and not real service to God, is indicated by the next four verses, which state:

“Therefore thou hast forsaken thy people the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and they please themselves in the children of strangers. Their land also is full of silver and gold, neither is there any end of their treasures; their land is also full of horses, neither is there any end of their chariots; their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, that which their own fingers have made; and the mean man boweth down, and the great man humbleth himself; therefore forgive them not.”

These verses show while they profess to know God, in works they deny him.

blessings in Christ,
John

PreciousMessage

When it comes to "tribulation" it refers to what believers suffer through. John 16:33. John, in Revelation 4 was told to "come up here." John did not actually go to Heaven in Rev. 4:1; he was simply taken up in a vision, while his toes remained on Patmos. Secondly the Church is on Earth after Revelation 4. How do we know this? Because Rev. says the beast will make "war with the saints" in Rev. 13:7.

Wherever there are saints, there is the Church. 1 Cor. 14:33 states, "churches of the saints."

Why would God leave His Church prophecies from John's day until the end of times? The populist view is that from the resurrection to the rapture, the majority leap over Romes' demise, the great apostasy, Islamic origins, papal power, the Dark Ages, the inquisition, and the Reformation almost entirely. With Holy Spirit perception, historicists not only see mighty prophecies fulfilled through out the Book of Revelation, but papal and Islamic scourges. Did you know that Islam is mentioned in the Bible after Rev. 4, so is the Papal power? Are Christians still amongst us, absolutely.

blessings in Christ,
John

Jasher

Part 1 of 2
What are last days? Time was broken down into the former days, which was before the captivity and the latter days as after the return from exile. The last days were the days of the Messiah. Peter said that the last days spoken by Joel was in his day. So the last days have been here for almost 2,000 years. It's not easy to answer the question about Israel in our day – it can't be done in a few paragraphs. But here goes...

Has God abandoned his ancient people?
Well of course not. His plan was to save the whole world and the family of Abraham had the absolute honor of being those through whom his plan of salvation would be carried out. Then what is he doing now and in the future in present day Israel? There is a popular eschatology that foresees all sorts of miraculous events, but I don't think they are very accurate or realistic. I think the real answer to this is to look at what God has done in the past and then to project forward from today. So this will be a different view from what you are accustomed to.


What has he done in the past starting from NT times.

1. Endless irrefutable miracles of healing in Israel via Jesus and his disciples.
2. Jesus was raised from the dead in three days – the body was never found.
3. Earthquake on day of Crucifixion. Darkness as the prophet said.
4. In the Temple a 30 ton stone lintel fell on the day of crucifixion that the veil or curtain was hung from, this tore the veil or curtain in two from the top to bottom. This curtain was very thick and heavy - and was approx 80 foot high by 25 foot wide and it covered the entrance of the Holy Place – not the Holy of Holies as some teach. It was said to take 200 priests to hang this beautiful curtain. By the way it was linen dyed with three different colors. The top was blue to signify the sky or heaven - God and his domain. The bottom was dyed crimson, which is an earth color representing man and his domain on the earth. The middle was purple, which is the result of mixing blue (God) with crimson (man), which is a picture of Jesus who is both God and Man - Jesus is represented by the purple.
5. The Chamber of Hewn Stone in the Temple was destroyed by the earthquake. This is where the Grand Sanhedrin met to conduct court. Jesus' trial was the last that the Sanhedrin ever held there. They had to move to the “Trading Place� also in the Temple compound. Another message for the Jews.

The concept of an all powerful God coming to earth as a humble member of humanity and dieing for his creation is a thought that would never enter the human mind in a million years. God carried out his plan surreptitiously. In fact the record shows only two people who really knew what was going on in Israel. This was old Simeon and old Anna the prophetess. The disciples were all looking for a literal kingdom right up to the end just like the crowds on the day of the triumphal entry.


But when the sacrifice of Jesus was complete, then it was no longer necessary to work in secrecy any more – the Good News could be broadcast from every hill and mountain to the whole world. Peter on the day of Pentecost basically said that they had killed the Messiah, but now all could come to him and receive forgiveness. And thousands did. From that time forward God gave Israel 40 years to repent. If they did not - he had told them that he would come to them in judgment. This was the same as the first temple of Solomon – he also gave them 40 years to repent and if they did not do so they went into captivity to Babylon. The Christians continued to preach Jesus until the stoning of Stephen and then the Church mostly moved out of Jerusalem to other cities and then the whole world. The Apostles went underground to escape the wrath of one - Saul of Tarsus.


After the crucifixion the forty years began. God was still active in giving signs to Israel just like before. Over the next forty years the following happened. (30AD to 70AD)

1. Every night for 40 years the western most lamp on the menorah went out. This was the lamp that they never extinguished – not even for maintenance. It was left burning day and night – a kind of eternal flame. This was the lamp closest to the Holy of Holies. By the way they could only use olive oil in the Menorah from beaten olives – another reference to Jesus.
2. In the ritual of the scapegoat – the priest drew lots to determine which of the two identical goats would be the sacrifice and which one of the two would be the scapegoat, which would be set free. In that entire forty year period the priest would reach into the leather bag and draw out the black stone and never the white. Statistics show that the odds of drawing 40 out of 40 is about 1,099,511,627,776 to one – yes over one trillion to one. This ritual also relates to Jesus as well. Remember when Pilot released Barabbas at the trial of Jesus? History shows that his first name was also Jesus. So his full name means “Jesus, The son of the high father.� This is identical to Jesus Messiah who had the same identical name and title – both goats were identical. This is the symbolic meaning of the ritual. Jesus the criminal was set free – the scapegoat - the sinner - set free by the atonement; and Jesus the Messiah was the sacrificial goat who was a sin offering on the day of Atonement.
3. The High priest wore on his person a scarlet cloth or cord. He went into the Holy of Holies only once per year on the Day of Atonement. The cloth was a report card of sorts. If God was pleased with them it would turn white, If God were not pleased it would remain scarlet. It would be different over the years, but starting in 30AD until the destruction of the Temple and Jerusalem - it never once turned white in 40 years.
4. The Temple doors to the Hekel chamber would open of their own accord every night just like the other phenomena. These were the doors to the Holy Place just behind the 80 foot curtain that had split. They interpreted this as a bad omen because of the passage in Zechariah, which indicated the burning of the Temple.

This was commonly known in Israel because there were a lot of priests that rotated duty in the Temple and it was a miraculous sign every day and everyday. Wouldn't you catch on after awhile? When did this all start?

Jasher

Part 2 of 2
Continued
Then in 66AD the rebellion or end began with a conflict in a Synagogue where a vengeful merchant blocked the entrance to a Synagogue and this grew and grew until the rebellion was in full fury in 67AD. But this was not the end of the signs and warnings. A brilliant light appeared over the alter one night in the Temple, which lasted for a half hour and then it left. It was said to make the temple as bright as daytime. One account by a Rabbi Jonathan said that the Shekinah glory departed the temple on Pentecost 66AD and hung over the top of the Mount of Olives for three and a half years – the very place where Jesus was crucified and ascended. This was the very same thing that happened just before Solomon's Temple was destroyed. Both temples were destroyed on the same day of the same month about 600 years apart.


Also on that same day of Pentecost 66AD at night all 24 Priests on duty heard a commotion and a loud roar and a voice like an army saying,�We are departing hence.�


Josephus also reports eyewitness accounts who saw chariots in the sky and battalions hurtling through the clouds and encompassing the cities. There was a star shaped like a sword and a comet that was visible for a year.


God gave Israel signs and wonders all through this forty year period and my list is not complete. Then the city fell into total corruption and violence when the terrorists took over the temple. Second Peter and Jude were letters of warning to the Christians not to become involved with the rebellion against Rome, but many did and this latent zealot mentality yearning for freedom from Rome divided the Church and caused a great falling away - just like the Apostles foretold. These zealot minded Christians were perverting the teaching of the Apostles and they remained in Jerusalem and suffered through the siege and destruction of the city in which some 1,100,000 perished out of an estimated 2,500,000 who were there for passover. The non zealot Christians escaped to Pella.


A second revolt occurred in135AD and this was the last. The Jews were once again dispersed all over the known world again. The once and for all time sacrifice was made and the Old Covenant was now gone forever. A new Temple would not need to be restored ever again - there was no need for it. The only temple that remains is the spiritual Temple that Jesus built when he arose from the dead – like he said he would do. This is Ezekiel's temple – you know the Temple that only has ONE Tamid (lamb) sacrifice a day. A single lamb. No court of women, no court of Israel, no court of gentiles – whatever could this mean?


But this was not accepted by the Jews and they continued with the Old Covenant as before. Except that God is now operating in the New Covenant. They made three attempts to rebuild the Temple, but were frustrated in every attempt. The first attempt was during the Bar Kochba revolt in 135AD. This attempt was put down by the Emperor Hadrian. The second attempt was in 324AD under Constantine. He gave permission and later withdrew it by cutting off the ears of the priests and craftsmen. No maimed person could work on the Temple. The third attempt was under the emperor Julian the Apostate. This was frustrated yet again by subterranean fires, which destroyed the works early in its construction.


Approximately 180,000,000 people lost their lives in war in the 20th century alone. The greatest single wartime loss was WWII with 55,000,000. The European Theater alone lost 26,000,000. Actual Jewish losses were a staggering 1,000,000 to 1,500,000 by non partial calculations – not political calculations.


The Christians had been nagging the Jews to return to their ancient land as far back as the time of Oliver Cromwell, who lived in the early 1600's. The present day Israel was established by total corruption and violence. If you want to know the other side of the story you need to read “The Zionist Connection" written by a Jewish man named Alfred M. Lilienthal 1983. Without the power of America – it would not have happened. It was not an act of God, but rather political manipulation and intrigue.


Israel began with a terrorist movement with the Stern Gang and the Irgun Zwai Leumi. Gangs that attacked a quiet Arab village Called Dier Yassin and purposely butchered the inhabitants throwing their bodies down a well. Then with loudspeaker trucks told the people to flee – 800,000 of them did and were never allowed to return to their homes. Lillienthal's book is full of accounts of the crooked and evil ways that the Jews were using to appropriate the Palestinian's land and possessions. The Jewish Arab conflict was so one sided that in decades past I would often speak up for the Palestinians. But no more.


If your neighbor is mad at you and keys your car all the way around - you will have my sympathy. But after you puncture all his tires repeatedly with an ice pick – you don't. It doesn't matter anymore who started it – the only hope is to come up with a settlement and stop the violence. Israel has made concessions to the Palestinians on a couple of occasions, but it is only seen by them as a victory and the violence continues. The radical Palestinians are not negotiating in good faith, but rather are driven to the annihilation of Israel – an agenda which I will not tolerate personally.


I said all of that to draw this conclusion: The Jews have treated the Palestinians unjustly in the earlier days and have filled them with a terrible resolve. The Jews have taken a tiger by the tail and can't let go or they will be devoured. Is God in this – of course he is, but he's letting them do their own thing and ratcheting up the pressure on them to break that hardness that they are so famous for. It's working – the number of Kahillits in Israel is growing by leaps and bounds. Nothing new because this is his standard modus operandi for bringing people into the kingdom. He does it everywhere – this is symbolized by the riders on the horses in Revelation.


How about a new temple? It will never happen because as I stated before - God is continually frustrating any movement in that direction. There is not one shred of an indication anywhere that this will happen. There is no longer any need for the old animal sacrifice system because the once and for all sacrifice has been made. God is trying to direct, steer, herd, the Jews into the New Covenant. Consider that even today God has already frustrated all the Orthodox plans for a new Temple because the place where they think it should go is under the control of the Muslims. This is the forth frustrated attempt to rebuild the Temple – is there a pattern here?

Michael

That was excellent. Thanks for sharing!

__________________
Life Is Short....Eternity Is Forever!
Laudate Jesu Christus!

Jasher

Thanks Michael - your comment alone makes the two hours it took me to write it worthwhile.

PreciousMessage

Thanks for your determination to share with me brother. Although, neither do I believe that God has intended for the Jews to build another temple.

Also, I'm really not sure of your point, the end conclusion. It may rest on me, not you.

But I will say that I believe that the Old and New Covenant are not matters of time, but of experience as pointed out by Paul.

Paul speaks of two covenants. "Abraham had two sons; the one by a bondwoman, [one of works], the other by a freewoman through promise. The New Covenant as soon as the fall. For the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.That is the new covenant promise. The old covenant is based on the bondwoman which leads to bondage. God has only one plan of salvation for all time. It is through the shed blood of Christ Jesus. Gal. 4:21-31.

John S

adonaicole

I believe that in the last days...

Israel will be surrounded by armies. Outgunned, outnumbered in soldiers, tanks, airplanes. God will miraculously deliver Israel, in 7 days and the defeated armies will report visions of angels in the skies defending Israel. Not only will they not lose land, they will gain, including Jerusalem.

O' wait, this one already happened.

__________________
Love one another, for that is pure, undefiled religion.

Don

Boanerges

Every aspect of the re-emergance of Israel was a miracle.

adonaicole

I so agree totally and it was all prophecied thousands of years ahead of time. Our God is an awesome God.

"Can these dry bones live? Thou knowest Lord."

Whenever I read these words I remember seeing pictures of Jews in the concentration camps. They were nothing but bones, dry bones in whom was no hope, but God used those "dry bones" to build a nation and an army. Glory to God in the highest.

__________________
Love one another, for that is pure, undefiled religion.

Don